From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-04-ewr.dyndns.com (mxout-097-ewr.mailhop.org [216.146.33.97]) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 531CB2E0392 for ; Tue, 15 Mar 2011 11:59:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scan-01-ewr.mailhop.org (scanner [10.0.141.223]) by mail-04-ewr.dyndns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 435D67E451D for ; Tue, 15 Mar 2011 18:59:08 +0000 (UTC) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 () X-Mail-Handler: MailHop by DynDNS X-Originating-IP: 130.207.165.161 Received: from deliverator1.gatech.edu (deliverator1.gatech.edu [130.207.165.161]) by mail-04-ewr.dyndns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9D9D7E450C for ; Tue, 15 Mar 2011 18:59:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost.localdomain (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0750F2DEF28; Tue, 15 Mar 2011 14:59:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from deliverator1.gatech.edu by deliverator1.gatech.edu with queue id 1188543-7; Tue, 15 Mar 2011 18:58:42 GMT Received: from mail5.gatech.edu (mail5.gatech.edu [130.207.185.165]) by deliverator1.gatech.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F5942DD2BA; Tue, 15 Mar 2011 14:58:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [192.168.43.49] (unknown [32.161.92.80]) (Authenticated sender: nf21@mail.gatech.edu) by mail5.gatech.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 6F3351FFBC; Tue, 15 Mar 2011 14:58:41 -0400 (EDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 From: Nick Feamster In-Reply-To: <87tyf4fc42.fsf@cruithne.co.teklibre.org> Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2011 14:58:27 -0400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <587F76A9-5EED-4D3D-B339-DE3979F50853@cc.gatech.edu> References: <87y64gfco1.fsf@cruithne.co.teklibre.org> <4D7FB356.2000407@gatech.edu> <87tyf4fc42.fsf@cruithne.co.teklibre.org> To: d@taht.net (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dave_T=E4ht?=) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) Cc: bismark-users@lists.bufferbloat.net Subject: Re: [Bismark-users] coping with conflicts X-BeenThere: bismark-users@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2011 18:59:09 -0000 I think we are both interested in: - measuring the current state of affairs (as a baseline) - designing techniques to try to improve latencies/problems - measuring how well respective techniques improve latencies/problems On Mar 15, 2011, at 2:54 PM, Dave T=E4ht wrote: > Nick Feamster writes: >=20 >> I agree. >=20 > To what? :) >=20 > Would you consider your existing study "ground truth" and the upcoming > one "revealed truth"? >=20 > When I talked to de-heisenberging below, the goal would be to = eliminate > or at least compensate/understand the factors introduced by the > measurement box. >=20 > Measuring cable modem and DSL latencies/problems and the internet > itself, remain a goal, but, for example, the end-user experience of > using the box itself with some/much of the new stuff is important to > us.=20 >=20 >>=20 >> On Mar 15, 2011, at 2:43 PM, Srikanth Sundaresan wrote: >>=20 >>> It seems to me that they can coexist; to study the impact of the >>> changes, we do need to know the existing ground truth, no? >>>=20 >>> - Srikanth >>>=20 >>> On 03/15/2011 02:42 PM, Dave T=E4ht wrote: >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> I have some conflicts that I would like to clearly resolve as we = ramp >>>> up. >>>>=20 >>>> 1) The bufferbloat project is trying to fix the internet >>>> 2) you are trying to study the internet as it exists >>>>=20 >>>> While some of the bufferbloat fixes in the pipeline will = de-heisenberg your >>>> measurements, the two ideas do conflict somewhat as does your = schedule >>>> vs ours.=20 >>>>=20 >>>> The wndr3700, which 6+ people have now, is looking to become a = focus of >>>> our efforts for item 1, and may ultimately become a model for the >>>> "perfect router". (Although I would bet on the upcoming 32MB flash = stuff >>>> coming out later this year as a better model) >>>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Bismark-users mailing list >>> Bismark-users@lists.bufferbloat.net >>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bismark-users >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Bismark-users mailing list >> Bismark-users@lists.bufferbloat.net >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bismark-users >=20 > --=20 > Dave Taht > http://nex-6.taht.net