From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-ee0-f43.google.com (mail-ee0-f43.google.com [74.125.83.43]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority" (verified OK)) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4E1CB200ADD; Sat, 3 Nov 2012 15:11:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ee0-f43.google.com with SMTP id c13so3001471eek.16 for ; Sat, 03 Nov 2012 15:11:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=CAEsaPWCVgQPNDqm2nUzdbOuBlXAz9PXy0jLO6kzENA=; b=LmAlVnTGkP7R+GzU0oMD7Ld7PRIqdQfldZXlnAImc7jqEfnXhCvgkIJ74ECHsBcLuK 4xk7nLV4PtvK9dEgyqNjNDOwOD0gwAXiuRUKlZ4ay+Qojz6bITSuhQhTAWZGOBQy1MX1 av/Xe68tq8V5ivYVCrkfzlSTvh8fPSXeLHiRG/rFNx4b+yOhx/DlCXuzPVwYCEr7d4R4 pC1/ydhleTtr8g0uThuHwyqnAT4BBxVfynkkBz8ixW0MVKN73kz1rc6vwlTZtp8fFSHq BUZXRSxTbTRWv/A65rsWu7OrQ0k17fPeRT8Sw2sWnHcrmdFc9upiw0YjWe/JJTmm6flX wT6A== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.14.216.193 with SMTP id g41mr20505386eep.37.1351980678079; Sat, 03 Nov 2012 15:11:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.223.180.10 with HTTP; Sat, 3 Nov 2012 15:11:18 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2012 23:11:18 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: getting fq_codel tested in the next year (in the ubuntu 13.4 test series?) somehow From: Dave Taht To: Jesper Dangaard Brouer , =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Toke_H=F8iland=2DJ=F8rgensen?= , bloat , codel@lists.bufferbloat.net, cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net, bloat-devel Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: bloat-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: "Developers working on AQM, device drivers, and networking stacks" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 03 Nov 2012 22:11:21 -0000 Jesper, Toke and I crashed the ubuntu kernel meeting at last weeks ubuntu developer summit in Copenhagen. We raised the issue of possibly getting fq_codel on on ubuntu by default (especially for desktops), and then had to explain bufferbloat to the meeting chair... About half the room then started chanting "bufferbloat", which was most amusing. (and gratifying) We have a chicken and egg problem, in that while the results for fq_codel on ethernet, especially, are very good, we still have to evolve that to a full pfifo_fast replacement. And: wider testing of what we have already is indicated, and I can't think of a better distro to get some of that done, than ubuntu, arch, and fedora. gentoo? During that meeting I tossed off a shorter, cleaner version of the debloat script which sets up fq_codel on ethernet or wifi on debian derived systems. https://github.com/dtaht/deBloat/blob/master/src/debloat.sh (getting this script to where it could be an optional package would be good. It could use some more work, tho) And (thx to toke's new netperf-wrapper tool) did a couple rather convincing demos at the conference. This was the first chance I'd had to exercise linux 3.6. While TCP small queues is amazing, fq_codel is even more amazing. Latency under load last year: http://www.teklibre.com/~d/bloat/pfifo_fast_vs_sfq_qfq_linear.png Linux 3.6 PFIFO_FAST: https://github.com/tohojo/netperf-wrapper/blob/master/sample_plots/100m_pfi= fo_fast.png Linux 3.6 FQ_CODEL: https://github.com/tohojo/netperf-wrapper/blob/master/sample_plots/100m_fq_= codel.png So there's been some commentary on this bug over at ubuntu https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/940541 that I haven't had time to jump in on. (help?) I'm curious (and it would help on that bug up there) as to what sorts of real world workloads people have been subjecting ubuntu/debian based servers/desktops to, now that BQL and fq_codel are standard in the kernel. Things that I would imagine are much better now are things like freeswitch's voip, while doing a backup, or heavy short web workloads, heavy db oriented samba workloads, skype while surfing, etc. Certainly streaming in general while doing anything else seems to be better, same for interactive traffic such as mosh. Enabling fq_codel on my laptop while dealing with various hotel and conference wifi seems to help in the transmit direction, too. Netperf's TCP_RR and/or ping are useful tools for seeing this, but it's hard to express the "feel" of something that is less annoying than it used to be. (Sigh: while at the same conference, I had one session with a 22 second RTT, on the wifi there) PS I'm also looking for a good web benchmark to be working with, something as good as google chrome's benchmarks, in conjuction with a string of very comprehensive, nasty tests I've been coming up with. ideas? PPS I'm sort of on a mission now to get BQL support into more hardware... particularly arm hardware, which seems to be mostly hooked up via the usb bus nowadays, there. PPPS I am now at linuxconf in barcelona where I hope to keep pushing the jello uphill. Anybody else here? --=20 Dave T=E4ht Fixing bufferbloat with cerowrt: http://www.teklibre.com/cerowrt/subscribe.= html