From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-pf1-x435.google.com (mail-pf1-x435.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::435]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EFDA43B29D for ; Wed, 31 May 2023 19:03:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-pf1-x435.google.com with SMTP id d2e1a72fcca58-64d293746e0so317320b3a.2 for ; Wed, 31 May 2023 16:03:12 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=networkplumber-org.20221208.gappssmtp.com; s=20221208; t=1685574191; x=1688166191; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:references:in-reply-to :message-id:subject:cc:to:from:date:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=y4tA/avF9nom1SkDuWjwVmAwGxsoTY63bin+g802p9o=; b=I3Eo9bn1p9Atm0/6abW/9w/yL9+gmyl5lf6RXkPDPGzhDi/JO0DbTLqCIHoNKMjLyw 90ykllRWwNT91jnX3Ljkprhz0LXxTzAgfwUEMsZsXoZuxC5uQxOdmZpClZ9u6ihCm4Ar J8X9ivF/UK4ksXYGJi1a6UtPRDzXsKuUoQ8SBrmqoYd0xoanySscBA3AgiqoFzuCihmJ 1qO4MGY45gPvZ8HsNJ96ZcBO88S2geCf69JKlmJaGOvQgmjPjhmXg+X3gWogT6M0bmmG pKE0HDbI8CG553bwMqrRmnxx3vACWUSXol/2MIsbfXCeDZy/tzkZj3NAlqBEsNIQffb9 aUSA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20221208; t=1685574191; x=1688166191; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:references:in-reply-to :message-id:subject:cc:to:from:date:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=y4tA/avF9nom1SkDuWjwVmAwGxsoTY63bin+g802p9o=; b=S+pRxr4nwyRocfobLvfyxD+qIcZ4sBj5IaYYwa0FoJYvHEr1w/L/MP18V/QPSv+XaN mt0vtDZgd7eflzJQb0hwIf2NhOtb5WMPLxAGaJyz2vy7s/+PueFKh+qwbeSThgcrg5NH WT5BpP9BHZ3tdo+AOzMFZnIMgTii9VQ5X7kqeYRXNLBmJm2xYXy8funGoWJyJ3mgB88X I65nF3EuUyJlCzs9bOS6bOjBU+KUMXUSpIRVxBYRCRy/0eL7kl2GsDRj0WC81GF9+b5/ vb1MefOtNB0kHjE/67AkHyeNLksTOLivsSP6XFWUcOQ8TolA5TskF10Wo0XcYF3fngk1 ox2Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AC+VfDy406aevCPlYK+9moHs91Efr7b4Z3QNqtB6Jw7/LWwHbLgJjxOQ 6vvc7REMo9xw8bAsWKNT/DEAo47rJhy0n7AzOvU8sw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ACHHUZ4KNGJBczzMa8kUPcqqU3wnojk2m0ThUlgpAn1wWrcJpQa0Uxh55K7a4M5lx18uB4fo5eIFLg== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6a00:1a51:b0:647:e45f:1a49 with SMTP id h17-20020a056a001a5100b00647e45f1a49mr7973999pfv.4.1685574191575; Wed, 31 May 2023 16:03:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hermes.local (204-195-120-218.wavecable.com. [204.195.120.218]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id s21-20020aa78d55000000b0063f0c9eadc7sm819141pfe.200.2023.05.31.16.03.10 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Wed, 31 May 2023 16:03:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 31 May 2023 16:03:09 -0700 From: Stephen Hemminger To: Dave Taht via Bloat Cc: Dave Taht , debayani.ghosh@thapar.edu, ee11s040@ee.iitm.ac.in, gaurav@ee.iitm.ac.in Message-ID: <20230531160309.426864df@hermes.local> In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [Bloat] why do people still study RED? X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 31 May 2023 23:03:13 -0000 On Wed, 31 May 2023 16:28:14 -0600 Dave Taht via Bloat wrote: > An otherwise good paper on RED vs drop tail here: > > https://arxiv.org/pdf/2303.10220.pdf > > Is it because we completely lack any analytical methods for taking a > hard look at drop or marking from the head, as codel does, or the > effect of the fq in fq_codel? > > I keep hoping somehow, somewhere, someone would show up with the tools > to explain the results I got here: > > https://blog.cerowrt.org/post/juniper/ > Probably because that is what all the big router vendors had available in 2010. Hopefully, they have started do something smarter in HW.