From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-pl1-x635.google.com (mail-pl1-x635.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::635]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 554063B29D for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2023 15:30:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-pl1-x635.google.com with SMTP id d9443c01a7336-1bc34b32785so21109695ad.3 for ; Sat, 05 Aug 2023 12:30:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=networkplumber-org.20221208.gappssmtp.com; s=20221208; t=1691263808; x=1691868608; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:references:in-reply-to :message-id:subject:cc:to:from:date:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=IahlzrYD/vqn0dsoPPv9Wvy8C+OaSCPoAYHDNqv64qw=; b=rA0vF8m6BQ57RdF0hPPw3H1oQVnXnz4K2fXn/Yf1tD4RvJRrK2KHxIEdZQkSJEWrEl 0BGwoD84PKh6SIp0Rg0ZfrUUCVd/0/O5s1YEkl+qZ3jwtNbZToqE6NRrihDabyk7n9Ee PnhTAptCU5MoNHXGoVqfLPBauFQ+kPouEGR5rKW6m9RnqYCppRCcUQKgIKGxL2Nn39tc BU1Q+K2YHy37dpnWElpCfZ/0A0lnAHNyj4bRS8SFfUDCAyFu+vS9w/7JRezDLbYLlJ3t crVVfI/vWBeT0TIjdMOkKCPS6pKq+bINsrIde5vbyBVhQUDtPStCMj269/q5b6ShvxtI M20g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20221208; t=1691263808; x=1691868608; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:references:in-reply-to :message-id:subject:cc:to:from:date:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=IahlzrYD/vqn0dsoPPv9Wvy8C+OaSCPoAYHDNqv64qw=; b=UK4hlvyG1OaN1pgDfKPYL+jB3U7JRt/Q4RpApX/yYHcTm56SZ508qrTie0UEuP3N31 sdjKsQNPkKCZ9IGnnZQF5774xQVtCMnXi3bI3FAswXazMrmUExQxY2XXHwJguoPR/QGL T8/tA6vd1oPZNEoBX5PJ1tSRPHGLxgepntAsxo9kctBu2EWDNv227OxqcQx9VTOpH3dD N3/qLCuONX/yjPt/XM8+w+zjEz0te0RPkpU8Bs45FUekCGF9LEPRG26ZRlZYGYF0NSqm iU5Vrd+2rCX9bUDqCQ6xACa9wvdVHzGno99hD00kpewuJycUkWxUIAGxUlCvccbTS34n TNLg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YwZN8cc3X8G7W12/kazzJbTploYi6fcA6jo4DPmIXH05hQ0Sh4d HCa60ZHOFfpwpXMwZCuVNWzYmhs6Y4NgXpcKzH8s/hTQ X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGjxZaChmRaTqWtd0a/7p8Zi7I+D5HZEainymcPNa0g4MpoRWpIBnjz0Pc0NJjI7kKCZcvncA== X-Received: by 2002:a17:903:22d1:b0:1b8:c6:ec8f with SMTP id y17-20020a17090322d100b001b800c6ec8fmr4461728plg.46.1691263807965; Sat, 05 Aug 2023 12:30:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hermes.local (204-195-127-207.wavecable.com. [204.195.127.207]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id m3-20020a170902768300b001b8a3dd5a4asm3852216pll.283.2023.08.05.12.30.07 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 05 Aug 2023 12:30:07 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2023 12:30:06 -0700 From: Stephen Hemminger To: Sean DuBois via Bloat Cc: Sean DuBois Message-ID: <20230805123006.2e0fb20c@hermes.local> In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [Bloat] Easiest/most effective way to test software against adverse networks? X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2023 19:30:09 -0000 On Sat, 5 Aug 2023 13:35:40 -0400 Sean DuBois via Bloat wrote: > I am working on improving Pion's Google Congestion Control algorithm > https://github.com/pion/interceptor/tree/master/pkg/gcc. As I start to use > it in more real world networks I find flaws. > > How are people testing software today? Is 'Traffic Control' the best option? Netem works but there are artifacts from the emulation. But my view on congestion control is that this sounds like Google doing NIH reinvention. Happens when you hire a lot of smart people "Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it"