From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-lf1-x12d.google.com (mail-lf1-x12d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::12d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EAA2E3B2A4 for ; Tue, 21 May 2024 12:18:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-lf1-x12d.google.com with SMTP id 2adb3069b0e04-51f1e8eaee5so4970046e87.1 for ; Tue, 21 May 2024 09:18:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1716308324; x=1716913124; darn=lists.bufferbloat.net; h=to:references:message-id:content-transfer-encoding:cc:date :in-reply-to:from:subject:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=UCqaRqITz1LG+r68SO4N0OUpYUXM+i7mhELKqo80CJ0=; b=X3GTOihDqqQhqZpxvsHGkqUk5EznIgZqhoN/dT4rRHr0GP6LnvmQeDk612v2tTQn9+ 2BpuSVqtI9QPUS8KN4M7cqifF/+L4czDJlJXanrBhVIoc+Q5Qi0rfk71oQrBqtBTj8eX h8fpguFa356SfasZqgKrCUC/2BbRXhSqRW3Oo/xr/gWU6JoXT2duWD/4Yn8Hd6AVMW5U nc5WoNxM67ChmvU0ef8dJllb2tOEQ4yAAFRDVYWjoFYw1larTkzrh/C9sfK1Umctq4Zn 3D9zOrsLEoLStojUv8YANEifFnKjoUOzev21gh3N0iXxefiaVIZJSr57IKr0jErCG+Kq VjMQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1716308324; x=1716913124; h=to:references:message-id:content-transfer-encoding:cc:date :in-reply-to:from:subject:mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=UCqaRqITz1LG+r68SO4N0OUpYUXM+i7mhELKqo80CJ0=; b=T6W/D39S81+w7BGGcnOn9zXDkK0G1MwobqDieTkAQPB0pWJ584UcNUljHVyfgSCfua JiaaojYBkxC8+F2O+ko9xq8PyQ3jl54K2eXLLluh8/KAzc4x97BZ1HV5PGx5XQLKEvAK tgI+00zPmhx969iL/foc3bmmDJIBh/JTRoslzFYs6qzIRKkXCwvlzUDCbz3tMcuZWsk6 ILMxP/Y6uDrWZrgJ2Oehv9FWoIi0PxNC0VAv0TltL2TXJrcRzAF0Su6IRjEtntdL/Yk+ KV11cbf3VSJS9JnmAA5qvzb1Vc7JHKTU+Sys00X1MBMTyzsiIcCH04wzX3rtFM17HUu+ ZtHw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyALGYNehWRXQhjLmdjXP00r/tG3m61M1AmHFSNz1i8BIQh/PMx WqqOLcamutQC011UxlrnNBlZkgE3v/uKhnqxAnAP93XwCr12CYe/ X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFS2T2PcoZvPcMyoNlyYjpVaSjeIslxIc06W5E5K3onIw9Hi2/52xv+yjuX8ELlx6qRYR/7vw== X-Received: by 2002:ac2:504a:0:b0:523:7680:d07 with SMTP id 2adb3069b0e04-52407ac106bmr3231363e87.6.1716308323259; Tue, 21 May 2024 09:18:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtpclient.apple (37-219-25-248.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi. [37.219.25.248]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 2adb3069b0e04-5238ec1d3e8sm2497762e87.267.2024.05.21.09.18.42 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 21 May 2024 09:18:42 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.100.0.2.22\)) From: Jonathan Morton In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 21 May 2024 19:18:41 +0300 Cc: bloat Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <28C0EFA5-8681-41DB-AF49-E551D1AA2A0A@gmail.com> References: To: Frantisek Borsik X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.100.0.2.22) Subject: Re: [Bloat] "Very interesting L4S presentation from Nokia Bell Labs on tap for RIPE 88 in Krakow this week! " X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 21 May 2024 16:18:46 -0000 > On 21 May, 2024, at 6:31 pm, Frantisek Borsik via Bloat = wrote: >=20 > Just "fresh from the oven", shared by Jason on social media: >=20 > = https://ripe88.ripe.net/wp-content/uploads/presentations/67-20240521_RIPE8= 8_L4S_introduction_Werner_Coomans_upload.pdf The usual set of half-truths, with a fresh coat of paint. Notice in = particular that the only *performance* comparisons they make are between = L4S and no AQM at all, not between L4S and conventional AQM - even = though they now mention that the latter *exists*. There's also no = mention whatsoever of what happens when L4S traffic meets a conventional = AQM. - Jonathan Morton