From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from sonic312-21.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com (sonic312-21.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com [74.6.128.83]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3B8F93B2A4 for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2019 18:10:06 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1575069005; bh=009t8AtcTapb6o7UjflBMb82hLZuAStrwM9LENlh/Ho=; h=Date:From:Reply-To:To:Cc:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject; b=bhZnSuJJ6uES16TgQJPynk7ogCO6SZWZFnfZ1aYDaIn9ALTseBtGOoSD+fn0Y3bE7BiXIT5iALiV2W5PZCLiFTEaUU8UrYG4lTYL8Gcx90FkjcJ9NMU3sGgB5qRuPCpv6o8gjEsCHVQR9px+XetljF5Vz1e261YE3+rWZlQZSk0Rjs/inltxMdaQEO6VyVGYtPIivaxTURx+5xJ+g8xO7mYj4A2ZeBjqmeVHza7NzZDbatvQdAj3MiHpd4ELrEmr8bMIOze6TY8NWsMTHkKe2T3Nziwg9nQgS+H1i2VElLAPu6Yo3WXeOXZk+OCZexGxb5y6kE6w9f7MJO4ADKMMOQ== X-YMail-OSG: ENQaq7YVM1kRqPYUDoZI6yLWhVKa7ZqdzINdJfVSFPVRtS72xkyW2qG7zPOxvYW wfbDaQ60KEQcJa5Iv6rrWg6oX4IwcRxzpVrs_t101vW6jL07A__SEjurtVPm2vsvaG0DPNsS1Eol 1e2ueH.j1SZLwmPjBomaY6KEWRb7GGMeN1INk3ahOFXhQG7I6d7eqqWESkv8wcXw49kLt776XImB H65pZWhAy6HYRtk_pvUQNHbVAQMukV7DAQ_bJ5t8efem0rzcUT.t3aomZtLmVQtUcwb.PVaZQk2C DhDFvygAvYtyzKBK31iUd41NltIsAm3mpQJpkHBk8Q6VNj9Dq3ajQwLVaUX3pJ6hOWMPCYaBPNp3 HZyMQWdJOALlOTgT.LonMreZhTFYtOBT38CaYvpzQv1k1kmX6G.yC.5kAmTrMZYWW1GkYwQC_Bmi y7yyZpnzpGSq5C_EwyJtbXXRVkMMH5.WrmE9NFLm431k_sm8mmLOv4gChsFhdYE9fHsoF.PkOoCD BqCaa_JamadM7VkSdLyC8T9OjKSdTDTlPQot.ADn7b0ubEJNgx00XsJUzB2snfWbscDLa44NvYLF o2eFL8xVLoq.QiZGRWCGZ5e6R1xqsA49EjGh83ZBeFNnDk_gPkcTzcDxgQozW0jOcgLlPJhcFgNx zeJQw3spSwdb5.Po4fIWXDPP2sYAXhS7fCdSJv2yvp9EKX0rK6yiYbNXF5CifqiwPdF5DXRe24wu rUfS5h9qzF.Gc4S9T6j8I36iGMhvqdLBgz_QRHQ9SuYSEj38D4mngKRiqEX0XyPyQrRc_idvgSfG eyzU7ycef8a1PZiV1oyxuiucwJ7xPsdL0Qsy6SIVrPP1CVnpcCbXLzrKUSRg7MCDl9JIUcRZZnmg ce.CEMEBWQImKj4K5RIQAkX9jaUi49hp14ui01BVa9uUFRmj5LqpMDndi6q24YZUhPJwWyLClgMN NfSCXAxDX2vekQQW9OHT8w.GzowxS1rEwjvpJM_jLf3Wt81YSLzxp7RYMlYBuwa6XPhN9ClUefs_ 0IAwyHWjgFdtOhdBnRyN8WSkRMAwZRHB.ftlOkdmWslLK79tc8JuCXspuY2I_F9xr.QN1uuiSj3g z_0uESVWE5qlN9l7sTuLDaJU10mNhZyyS0XpA4RM8BZEiPjjmAOCrALXxBgxUE3iEJgdktX.6STd k7wUPcZyFR0ib.8ZVwu3CL_hPe21FpihRUxAwxmqe6ZxYdpMBL_NXr.K1cd9cQeGWJVWFp8eXXoS QtsJ9w4PtgImXIEFNqNBrl7OP8WVvsCGKkJfg2DJJ6rTfNkOnU7lPyNWx6dGo5Wux2vsngN.UMjn uePKA29H1Ra1qur_TkGqUnKIAoKw- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic312.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Fri, 29 Nov 2019 23:10:05 +0000 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2019 23:10:01 +0000 (UTC) From: "alex.burr@ealdwulf.org.uk" Reply-To: "alex.burr@ealdwulf.org.uk" To: Dave Taht , Jonathan Morton Cc: ECN-Sane , bloat Message-ID: <297503679.4519449.1575069001960@mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <63E9C0E4-C913-4B2F-8AFC-64E12489BC65@gmail.com> References: <63E9C0E4-C913-4B2F-8AFC-64E12489BC65@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.14728 YMailNorrin Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:70.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/70.0 Subject: Re: [Bloat] sce materials from ietf X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2019 23:10:06 -0000 On Friday, November 29, 2019, 9:51:21 PM GMT, Jonathan Morton wrote: > Second, I gained a couple of key insights that I think will help to solve= SCE's remaining shortcomings.=C2=A0 If we can apply them successfully by= =20 > Vancouver, we'll be able to stand up and say not only that SCE meets *all= * of the Prague Requirements, while L4S is currently missing two of them, > but that we've also solved the single-queue problem.=C2=A0 I'm deliberate= ly leaving the technical details vague until we've done some testing, but I= will say=20 > that the name we've come up with is amusing. I don't see what you gain by going after the Prague requirements. They're i= nternal requirements for a TCP that would fulfill the L4S goals if classifi= ed into the L4S side of a DualQ AQM: 'Packet Identification' means that the= L4S AQM can identify L4S supporting flows. This seems like a distraction f= rom your main pitch to me. It would seem better to compare against the actu= al goals of L4S (AFAICT, low latency at the 99th percentile, in the presenc= e of Reno-compatible flows, with some fairness requirement which I increasi= ngly don't understand). Alex