From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-wi0-x22e.google.com (mail-wi0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c05::22e]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3D12C21F1EE for ; Tue, 26 May 2015 02:14:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: by wicmc15 with SMTP id mc15so58559518wic.1 for ; Tue, 26 May 2015 02:13:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:content-type; bh=E8ek1CJOnYoNVpy/tHw6tUdVprcmKm2E0X5SnB0vasc=; b=J3E87Q3jM2Z60o7ncFln/vBbXvtdFx6Mzo8WDJJg2yzG2g+4dJFp/tlKit1F0mfxGE BNtHkMBVxxplBjTAt3Qrf4iuijJwZRStn1QCUlGD/p+3sXaEzHiIxmq3NwAx5GoJUFNi rH++BBMZNiJ++V6otbdAz3EE7e4F24k6jRMZraYaLHG/iXmHgsbfvzlo7kCS8gVx41CN yAbc7qBi2OuGDkX4Ssl/uRqYYwU/8N4NWwkO27GdiiKkxH3g1Ie20c6SevOlhNbOef/C KPm9AuQfP4mKJ0a6sHy9VuhFLY7jIYK6Yc7oKYjDcM2h9ExFZ2h6PT2Xt7iMPg/hrTDd Jhmg== X-Received: by 10.194.220.100 with SMTP id pv4mr6741650wjc.71.1432631633524; Tue, 26 May 2015 02:13:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from volcano.localdomain (host-92-11-248-238.as43234.net. [92.11.248.238]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id pg1sm9564696wjb.39.2015.05.26.02.13.52 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 26 May 2015 02:13:52 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <5564394F.8080505@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 26 May 2015 10:13:51 +0100 From: Alan Jenkins User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: jb , bloat References: <555C825C.1010607@darbyshire-bryant.me.uk> <555F37AF.5080406@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------000004040309020308010505" Subject: Re: [Bloat] Fwd: dslreports and inbound rate shaping X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 May 2015 09:14:55 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------000004040309020308010505 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 25/05/15 22:39, jb wrote: > Regarding this part: > > > The baseline latency is because the bloat measurement uses a single > websocket ping server in America. Justin said in the forums it didn't > seem worth the effort to set up more of them. Seems worth an faq item > though :(. > > Below huge speeds, upload testing is done with web socket now, > so there is a websocket address on every server now anyway. > > The baseline pinging to dslreports.com doesn't > seem broken > but if necessary it can be changed to baseline pinging to the > nearest server, wherever that is. > Personally I might be skewed by using Firefox on Linux, I don't see the awesome live bloat-meter, only the awesome bloat graphs. PS My firefox also doesn't show the new graph-based speedtest history. I disabled the obvious culprits (noscript, ghostery, ublock) & there's nothing on the JS console. Happy to help if needed. "Fixing" the bufferbloat ping graph would make it more directly comparable to the pings on other speedtests. I think that makes the bufferbloat point clearer. Again the issue is outside the US; in the UK I see a 100ms "baseline". If it's simple to start using nearer servers, that would make me very happy :). I agree it's not "broken". (I also use netperf-eu at 59ms). It's just confusing to interpret, if you don't already know what bufferbloat is going to look like. Particularly as the "expected" low ping value shown at the start. The 100ms server isn't even shown on the ping radar part. If it's easier to just call out the destination country on the bufferbloat ping, or fudge the figures convincingly (just graph the increases from a minimum), that would answer my point too. Thanks Alan > > > The elephant in my personal room is the high latency baseline > > > measurement. None of the ping response time test sites I've checked > > give me anywhere near a baseline ping rtt of 100ms. Even dslreports > > say "London UK is ~10ms, Google Europe is ~17ms, Dublin, Ireland, EU > > is ~20ms, Frankfurt, DE, EU is ~27ms" So I clearly don't > > understand some thing(s) about this test. > > > > Anyway, that's been an interesting 2 hours of playing! > > > > Kevin > > Good fun :). > > The baseline latency is because the bloat measurement uses a > single websocket ping server in America. Justin said in the > forums it didn't seem worth the effort to set up more of them. > Seems worth an faq item though :(. > --------------000004040309020308010505 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 25/05/15 22:39, jb wrote:
Regarding this part:

> The baseline latency is because the bloat measurement uses a single websocket ping server in America.  Justin said in the forums it didn't seem worth the effort to set up more of them.  Seems worth an faq item though :(.

Below huge speeds, upload testing is done with web socket now,
so there is a websocket address on every server now anyway.

The baseline pinging to dslreports.com doesn't seem broken
but if necessary it can be changed to baseline pinging to the
nearest server, wherever that is.


Personally I might be skewed by using Firefox on Linux, I don't see the awesome live bloat-meter, only the awesome bloat graphs.

PS My firefox also doesn't show the new graph-based speedtest history.  I disabled the obvious culprits (noscript, ghostery, ublock) & there's nothing on the JS console.  Happy to help if needed.

"Fixing" the bufferbloat ping graph would make it more directly comparable to the pings on other speedtests.  I think that makes the bufferbloat point clearer.  Again the issue is outside the US; in the UK I see a 100ms "baseline".  If it's simple to start using nearer servers, that would make me very happy :).

I agree it's not "broken".  (I also use netperf-eu at 59ms).  It's just confusing to interpret, if you don't already know what bufferbloat is going to look like.

Particularly as the "expected" low ping value shown at the start.  The 100ms server isn't even shown on the ping radar part.

If it's easier to just call out the destination country on the bufferbloat ping, or fudge the figures convincingly (just graph the increases from a minimum), that would answer my point too.

Thanks
Alan

> > The elephant in my personal room is the high latency baseline
> measurement.  None of the ping response time test sites I've checked
> give me anywhere near a baseline ping rtt of 100ms.  Even dslreports
> say "London UK is ~10ms, Google Europe is ~17ms, Dublin, Ireland, EU
> is ~20ms, Frankfurt, DE, EU is ~27ms"   So I clearly don't
> understand some thing(s) about this test.
>
> Anyway, that's been an interesting 2 hours of playing!
>
> Kevin

Good fun :).

The baseline latency is because the bloat measurement uses a single websocket ping server in America.  Justin said in the forums it didn't seem worth the effort to set up more of them.  Seems worth an faq item though :(.

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