From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-wm0-x241.google.com (mail-wm0-x241.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::241]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 169013BA8E for ; Wed, 20 Jun 2018 11:57:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x241.google.com with SMTP id r15-v6so391846wmc.1 for ; Wed, 20 Jun 2018 08:57:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=As6ig4jqAyATGstwAjUhfGM8GopmYRUw3cYgMACKuhs=; b=l2NdCR2GI1c36gJNobHGAa4R5HMR2WXBqFpJG9doL3Z2pkCVm2VdGW2lvH7iwawOK4 BO/bW3PPmDwTlkqZY8eYI6/odySoLgIq7bklh4ShFFgR2FDySRnwRh99m+JpR5Mn+07Z iAtS2d6u0Hf5NEr87rQjB6LadEXgEqZDPX+LBipGhh9gi7tpQflxTmuaQzPG6d3bFg96 9WFCl8J+HQ9Nfnv0oBMR8g/Pl/QSaNwziS4ff+BAEAv9/OQ4S3OyIH1LkAAbOaR4LDBS p3/4p0alwtwNN69V6L5ZIML+k/NqZHqepiOfk8g8nJnR9pmJIGyLDMYJN6clNhLGvyOf 3LYA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=As6ig4jqAyATGstwAjUhfGM8GopmYRUw3cYgMACKuhs=; b=iBYltxcmEs2yEwXsusVPosKJu2cnW4df4KEl6a+Q1JnUjdP/7wv/gcuV5U0ghBYINW TfjwONWChj64uKJ49TZhIi4AWXNbBGNzwsNibEPiJuoyAohLeFTjd0kwGsA86CuMU16f t1I+ij7+Jy8BZc3pbmeXMhEX7+XThqRrDBI2epiSPPvyEr5MrPdUE75WFrngpqKoE+8N 1sd7kjiWC1xLKb0/nGzfJyMwxUwlHcvfOWaZKJN5zk4XiOYsp1DdgF4EszOUDVt3HGJi O9qZKxZwzpxcoDODUnqG9O92p6E3KsxZnXzDM59g2Z3DMrHn72ATB+DtmKb8SYhW/SzW hfeA== X-Gm-Message-State: APt69E1C1G4tT10Rp6nDLOOusfTXE9aW/p9BaRC8IP0uxypS3QGrLnBo 6dZTCwTE/MpG9afTlMSjgf0iBgF1 X-Google-Smtp-Source: ADUXVKINUNHK7a6I2jaWA2nwZ7cpkc2WnTxMtF1l2JH91HH7/TRRFT9cKRF8YTRKUAWwj2qj9IMI3w== X-Received: by 2002:a1c:d809:: with SMTP id p9-v6mr2163365wmg.111.1529510263908; Wed, 20 Jun 2018 08:57:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zotac.xperim.be ([91.179.60.25]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a1-v6sm2680042wrq.54.2018.06.20.08.57.43 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 20 Jun 2018 08:57:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.184] (bajor.xperim.be [192.168.1.184]) by zotac.xperim.be (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 80D1A48A6D2; Wed, 20 Jun 2018 17:57:42 +0200 (CEST) To: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net References: <1529339194.276412941@apps.rackspace.com> <1529361825.80979395@apps.rackspace.com> <145517.1529440447@turing-police.cc.vt.edu> From: Jan Ceuleers Message-ID: <67ee54f6-444e-1568-3419-23c434792157@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2018 17:57:42 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [Bloat] [Cerowrt-devel] Invisibility of bufferbloat and its remedies X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2018 15:57:45 -0000 On 20/06/18 01:41, Jonathan Morton wrote: >> On 19 Jun, 2018, at 11:34 pm, valdis.kletnieks@vt.edu wrote: >> >> Do we have a good cookbook on how to determine the set-rate? > > On DSL, the sync rates in each direction should usually be readable from the modem; they are typically reported on the router's status page. The advertised rate is less reliable, to say the least. I'm afraid that my DSL modem doesn't belong to the "usually" case. I have a BBox3 from Proximus (Belgium). Proximus buys these from two manufacturers: Technicolor and Sagemcom. I have the Sagemcom variant. Proximus went out of their way to avoid that end users be able to query the modem for its connection parameters. There is still an indirect way to do so in the Sagemcom variant (and so I know that my modem provides 50Mbit/s down and 10Mbit/s up) but for marketing reasons Proxinus would prefer its users not to know. The reason is that their principal competitor, cable operator Telenet (owned by Liberty Global) would win the game based on raw link speed. So whereas I have access to the information I need to be able to configure my queues there are others who do not, and it would be good for a generic method to exist that derives the correct parameters from measurements. Kathy put it more succinctly: there is a good case for monitoring. Question is what to monitor and how to set/modify the qdisc parameters. Jan