From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-out02.uio.no (mail-out02.uio.no [IPv6:2001:700:100:8210::71]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6552D3CB35 for ; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 15:38:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail-mx04.uio.no ([129.240.10.25]) by mail-out02.uio.no with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1f3oEP-00087p-Qd; Wed, 04 Apr 2018 21:38:05 +0200 Received: from 189.162.173.62.cust.ip.kpnqwest.it ([62.173.162.189] helo=[192.168.3.146]) by mail-mx04.uio.no with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) user michawe (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1f3oEO-0006tD-QJ; Wed, 04 Apr 2018 21:38:05 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Michael Welzl X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (15D100) In-Reply-To: <12848.1522869826@obiwan.sandelman.ca> Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2018 21:38:02 +0200 Cc: Dave Taht , bloat , Jonathan Morton Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <7DC0ADE6-3D20-417F-8940-96E4A68197B5@ifi.uio.no> References: <50e57074-4ca5-59f7-f010-d9b2b845a8a7@rogers.com> <8DE589C3-9537-416D-AC7C-9250464869F9@gmail.com> <0ED5B59A-5C31-4F70-A2C9-04D9EA779A7B@ifi.uio.no> <12848.1522869826@obiwan.sandelman.ca> To: Michael Richardson X-UiO-SPF-Received: Received-SPF: neutral (mail-mx04.uio.no: 62.173.162.189 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of ifi.uio.no) client-ip=62.173.162.189; envelope-from=michawe@ifi.uio.no; helo=[192.168.3.146]; X-UiO-Spam-info: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-5.0, required=5.0, autolearn=disabled, TVD_RCVD_IP=0.001, UIO_MAIL_IS_INTERNAL=-5, uiobl=NO, uiouri=NO) X-UiO-Scanned: E05B8F94FA5AB0270E1E1B2F3C3A85F39CB43F4E Subject: Re: [Bloat] Seen in passing: mention of Valve's networking scheme and RFC 5348 X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 19:38:08 -0000 Sent from my iPhone > On 4 Apr 2018, at 21:23, Michael Richardson wrote: >=20 >=20 > Dave Taht wrote: >> How dead is posix these days? Ietf does not generally do apis well. >=20 > I disagree. >=20 > IETF has lore says that it doesn't do APIs well, and so it's a > self-fullfiling prophecy. Everyone knows it's true without any actual > evidence, so nobody tries. >=20 > Who does do APIs well today? Microsoft's API story is a disaster, > so despite decades of market dominance, their networking APIs are not > defacto standard. While it looks like Linux does APIs well, actually, > it just does a really good job at getting the public APIs implemented. >=20 > The IPv6 BSD sockets API is a roaring success. > It's just not enough given MIF, DNSSD, IPsec, LISP, etc. The problem > space has expanded. >=20 > The problem is getting API work funded across Google, Apple, MS, *BSD, > and Linux. fwiw, apple is on board of taps and actively involved, and the neat project = ( www.neat-project.org ) made an open source library that runs on linux and= bsd systems >=20 > -- > ] Never tell me the odds! | ipv6 mesh networ= ks [ > ] Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works | network architec= t [ > ] mcr@sandelman.ca http://www.sandelman.ca/ | ruby on rails = [ >=20