From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-11-iad.dyndns.com (mxout-211-iad.mailhop.org [216.146.32.211]) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FB2D2E04C5 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2011 11:43:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from scan-11-iad.mailhop.org (scan-11-iad.local [10.150.0.208]) by mail-11-iad.dyndns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0BEC171EE8 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2011 19:43:41 +0000 (UTC) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 () X-Mail-Handler: MailHop by DynDNS X-Originating-IP: 134.157.0.129 Received: from shiva.jussieu.fr (shiva.jussieu.fr [134.157.0.129]) by mail-11-iad.dyndns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C981171ED4 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2011 19:43:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: from hydrogene.pps.jussieu.fr (hydrogene.pps.jussieu.fr [134.157.168.1]) by shiva.jussieu.fr (8.14.4/jtpda-5.4) with ESMTP id p18JhCsQ021543 ; Tue, 8 Feb 2011 20:43:26 +0100 (CET) X-Ids: 168 Received: from lanthane.pps.jussieu.fr (lanthane.pps.jussieu.fr [134.157.168.57]) by hydrogene.pps.jussieu.fr (8.13.4/jtpda-5.4) with ESMTP id p18JhBNY022118 ; Tue, 8 Feb 2011 20:43:11 +0100 Received: from jch by lanthane.pps.jussieu.fr with local (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PmtSx-0004Yq-JB; Tue, 08 Feb 2011 20:43:11 +0100 From: Juliusz Chroboczek To: esr@thyrsus.com References: <20110205132305.GA29396@thyrsus.com> Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2011 20:43:11 +0100 In-Reply-To: <20110205132305.GA29396@thyrsus.com> (Eric Raymond's message of "Sat, 5 Feb 2011 08:23:06 -0500") Message-ID: <7ilj1qcnxs.fsf@lanthane.pps.jussieu.fr> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Miltered: at jchkmail.jussieu.fr with ID 4D519CD0.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 4D519CD0.003/134.157.168.1/hydrogene.pps.jussieu.fr/hydrogene.pps.jussieu.fr/ Cc: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net Subject: Re: [Bloat] First draft of complete "Bufferbloat And You" enclosed. X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2011 19:43:43 -0000 > If too many cars try to use the road at once, bad things happen. One > of those bad things is cars running off the road and crashing. The > Internet analog of this is called 'packet loss'. We want to hold it to > a minimum. I object to that, since it compares packet loss to a catastrophic failure. (I would personally argue against a car analogy in the first place, but that's just stylistic preference.) > Suppose your rule for when a car gets to leave the parking lot is the > simplest possible: it fills up until it overflows, then cars are let > out the downstream side as fast as they can go. I'm not sure what kind of buffer you're trying to illustrate. That's certainly not how I understand tail-drop buffers. Finally, I'd argue that you're being too harsh on QoS techniques. --Juliusz