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From: "Livingood, Jason" <Jason_Livingood@comcast.com>
To: Jeremy Austin <jeremy@aterlo.com>, dan <dandenson@gmail.com>
Cc: Dave Taht via Starlink <starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net>,
	libreqos <libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net>,
	Jamal Hadi Salim <jhs@mojatatu.com>,
	Rpm <rpm@lists.bufferbloat.net>,
	bloat <bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net>
Subject: Re: [Bloat] [LibreQoS] [Rpm] net neutrality back in the news
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2023 20:54:54 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <850D399A-AF3F-480F-B671-F3C9FBD3A122@cable.comcast.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CACw=56+D6rEDE6k8Dwmq=AjWW-jpEwPUdWqaFTocdWa-VZNsNA@mail.gmail.com>

> From: Bloat <bloat-bounces@lists.bufferbloat.net> on behalf of Jeremy Austin via Bloat <bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net>

> I'm interested in seeing how one can enforce the 'will of the people' -- the application vendors (who are doing everything in their power to prevent ISPs identifying *anything* about the traffic) will certainly not obey such a will, and the ISP can in good faith implement such a prioritization service but have no power to cryptographically authenticate such traffic. This seems a dead end where no one is willing to bear the cost.

Great point! Back in the old days, sure you could use DPI to identify flow X as streaming video, flow Y as web traffic, and flow Z as email. No more - based on 3rd party stats somewhere between 90% - 95% of traffic is encrypted (increasing all the time) -- so no more ability to accurately infer application type and trigger a network response based on that. 

Great doc on the shift to pervasive encryption: https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9446.html "Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations"

JL 






  reply	other threads:[~2023-09-28 20:55 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 44+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2023-09-27 18:21 [Bloat] " Dave Taht
2023-09-28  3:33 ` [Bloat] [Rpm] " rjmcmahon
2023-09-28  6:06   ` Dave Taht
2023-10-01 17:08     ` [Bloat] [Starlink] " Sebastian Moeller
2023-10-05 19:22       ` Dave Taht
2023-09-28  6:25 ` [Bloat] " Sebastian Moeller
     [not found]   ` <ZRUe_5uiRJyDxb9Z@Space.Net>
2023-09-28  7:14     ` [Bloat] [Starlink] " Sebastian Moeller
     [not found]       ` <ZRUsLalRicJpQoXH@Space.Net>
2023-09-28  7:38         ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-09-28 16:38   ` [Bloat] " Dave Taht
2023-09-28 16:52     ` [Bloat] [Starlink] " Livingood, Jason
2023-09-28 17:04       ` [Bloat] [Rpm] [Starlink] " rjmcmahon
2023-09-28 19:31     ` [Bloat] [Rpm] " Sebastian Moeller
2023-09-28 19:39       ` Dave Taht
2023-09-28 20:08         ` [Bloat] [LibreQoS] " dan
2023-09-28 20:18           ` Dave Taht
2023-09-29 19:00             ` [Bloat] Getting Google to index. was:Re: [Starlink] " Rodney W. Grimes
2023-09-28 20:36           ` [Bloat] " Jeremy Austin
2023-09-28 20:54             ` Livingood, Jason [this message]
2023-09-28 20:48           ` [Bloat] [Starlink] " Livingood, Jason
2023-09-28 22:19             ` David Lang
2023-09-29  4:54               ` Jonathan Morton
2023-09-29 12:28                 ` [Bloat] [Rpm] [Starlink] [LibreQoS] " Rich Brown
2023-09-29 16:15                   ` dan
2023-09-30 12:00                     ` Frantisek Borsik
2023-09-30 12:19                       ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-09-30 12:42                         ` [Bloat] [Starlink] [Rpm] " Vint Cerf
2023-09-30 14:07                           ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-09-30 14:28                         ` [Bloat] [Rpm] [Starlink] " Jan Ceuleers
2023-09-30 14:35                           ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-09-30 14:41                         ` Mike Conlow
2023-09-30 15:20                           ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-09-30 15:23                             ` [Bloat] [LibreQoS] [Rpm] [Starlink] " Dave Taht
2023-09-30 17:35                               ` Dave Taht
2023-09-30 21:57                                 ` [Bloat] New email list: NNagain for network neutrality Dave Taht
2023-10-04 22:19                           ` [Bloat] [Rpm] [Starlink] [LibreQoS] net neutrality back in the news Michael Richardson
2023-09-29  6:24               ` Sebastian Moeller
     [not found]                 ` <ZRZvMLtKhkd6-16m@Space.Net>
2023-09-29  7:07                   ` [Bloat] [Starlink] [Rpm] " Sebastian Moeller
2023-09-28 22:25           ` [Bloat] [LibreQoS] [Rpm] " David Lang
2023-09-28 17:10   ` [Bloat] " Livingood, Jason
2023-09-28 19:30     ` Dave Taht
2023-09-28 20:05     ` Sebastian Moeller
2023-09-28 21:07       ` [Bloat] [EXTERNAL] " Livingood, Jason
2023-09-28 21:08         ` Livingood, Jason
2023-09-29  8:56         ` Erik Auerswald

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