From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-lf1-x134.google.com (mail-lf1-x134.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::134]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 330BD3B29E; Sat, 25 Apr 2020 20:52:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-lf1-x134.google.com with SMTP id h6so10890967lfc.0; Sat, 25 Apr 2020 17:52:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=PJGiUHQs4mEnWxl0LxCxY7fYISAg3cvx3imDn5maDQ4=; b=Sk4HM2L10hOfxQNx2aKWS5UXrdCw1AFIfr5Esc8c+O7OmTjKp/DaJ3uO/9663Hmpqn orLMTrZRVKjx7GlJ3kncbiSupOVHWkmQ+SWIBP5JLWXfsqUvFvSwkepXnmqXxskXKvHQ BI53iNZXAzmZD/Rw+FNZvC2E4IjM+J7PViSD1u1G2i4H4qMofIZfF5a2gsWcov4JmD2m pPTvu6sDT8rjz1oQGIVUTwtRw943eLUdNuptlQb3oBH+qkgsaTDqFEkv+Lf1Q0ZDhAAg xNYciqMW9s+/wcMiw6k9cGgwWmL5JT2PBHT+Kt4uhrOgwsxCQFMVqK5CKpTZC0+C9bgc bt1Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=PJGiUHQs4mEnWxl0LxCxY7fYISAg3cvx3imDn5maDQ4=; b=qO+5KULYz5S/1w125bMGkuXcpJAUSpXiEg9OVmQoJNMVF/t5U0PVnQ6A9tM9ioPO4f EjBrRAm9i/vaknOZF3VRJaNkwyVaMVN3UdQCiU6Ns0O6rRpefk07Bzf9HMoF1oKgYgtX ZQrtPxg4FLf00s4Y+JW08T+i74fBqTX9opfzK25PjtEJ02aP3Q0qWC3Ppr4GscZJXRks 69p36Vz8NHYg5mEyTVFAJw3h/U90VB9ZvrzQEqgymNVziuCkCKyx3fjYit7oPkbBpll1 qCLGKVbSbOs3/cjEvmXbiSn1CwWfcCDt9hi+j0FEchA9yK3xpCthj3WZ1x8DfiOfrdMw goFA== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PubXPNpY3tNOmOXm2pJhCQ17ALwSpA2As2C4NwUC+x3GkSZkNVYP hcBsqis0msqua81LtT0bQWU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypJlesWe3STlpdZmsRJ7VoQ1LrNUH3jQmgTckqxRvcvbqv/SOdaANac+Dam4nfg0PREiRgKiSA== X-Received: by 2002:ac2:4c39:: with SMTP id u25mr11086566lfq.54.1587862337120; Sat, 25 Apr 2020 17:52:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jonathartonsmbp.lan (83-245-235-192-nat-p.elisa-mobile.fi. [83.245.235.192]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g3sm4294550ljk.27.2020.04.25.17.52.16 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 25 Apr 2020 17:52:16 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Jonathan Morton In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 26 Apr 2020 03:52:15 +0300 Cc: bloat , ECN-Sane Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <85F248E2-E1B5-45A6-8E45-EBCA43B82A09@gmail.com> References: To: Dave Taht X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Subject: Re: [Bloat] dropbox, bbr and ecn packet capture X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 26 Apr 2020 00:52:18 -0000 > On 26 Apr, 2020, at 3:36 am, Dave Taht wrote: >=20 > I just did a rather large dropbox download. They are well known to be > using bbr and experimenting with bbrv2. So I fired off a capture > during a big dropbox download... >=20 > It negotiated ecn, my fq_codel shaper and/or my newly ath10k > fq_codel's wifi exerted CE, osx sent back ecn-echo, and the rtt > results were lovely. However, there is possibly not a causal > relationship here, and if anyone is bored and wants to scetrace, > tcptrace or otherwise tear this cap apart, go for it. Well, the CE response at their end is definitely not Multiplicative = Decrease. I haven't dug into it more deeply than that. But they're = also not running AccECN, nor are they "proactively" sending CWR to get a = "more accurate" CE feedback. I suspect they're running BBRv1 in this = one. - Jonathan Morton=