From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from grace.univie.ac.at (grace.univie.ac.at [IPv6:2001:62a:4:25::25:115]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A725321F186 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2012 07:49:19 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=univie.ac.at; s=rev2; h=To:References:Message-Id:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Cc:Date:In-Reply-To:From:Content-Type:Mime-Version:Subject; bh=hXWmnnbzOgOcl7jKPDZr7HjBWn7hn9X/2+JJjRCafR4=; b=AorJxeQcj1wtNU9ieeW7fkd2ujxlBcFnPFNckjJJzXsONyUHxKFsw309WdSfGleHslhCXz/tZC8KqE1z1r+5HzXd2k1FbxquVRdxcKnX7QupvuMqu67bzlVWNA653WZP5QlYkozywEwVGzBsBRxOVSqKSQef1MtcWURCaV2bnyA=; Received: from justin.univie.ac.at ([131.130.3.111] helo=justin.univie.ac.at) by grace.univie.ac.at with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1TR2Gi-0002Aa-7o; Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:49:16 +0200 Received: from 046074107031.atmpu0004.highway.a1.net ([46.74.107.31] helo=[192.168.43.184]) by justin.univie.ac.at with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1TR2Gh-00050I-6O; Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:49:16 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1085) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Albert Rafetseder In-Reply-To: <4C04E6DB-F9A4-4326-818B-17D953CA1D39@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:49:11 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <907294EF-570F-473D-A87A-B6238B6EA733@univie.ac.at> References: <4C04E6DB-F9A4-4326-818B-17D953CA1D39@gmail.com> To: bloat X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1085) X-Univie-Virus-Scan: scanned by ClamAV on justin.univie.ac.at Subject: Re: [Bloat] "a bandwidth breakthrough" X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2012 14:49:20 -0000 Am 24.10.2012 um 02:39 schrieb Jonathan Morton: > On 24 Oct, 2012, at 12:24 am, Dave Taht wrote: >=20 >> I've had 3 separate people send me this today. >>=20 >> http://www.technologyreview.com/news/429722/a-bandwidth-breakthrough/ >>=20 >> Sure wish we had a PR dept here that was this good vs a vs fq_codel. >>=20 >> I *think* I've read the relevant paper "Modeling network coded TCP >> throughput"? But perhaps there is something newer driving this >> announcement? >=20 > [...] > I'm actually sort of surprised that the inter-packet version isn't = already built into wireless technologies by default, especially the ones = that do packet aggregation. In any case it is not totally new - a very = similar idea is used in CDs. In the case of the four Austrian 3.99G mobile operators we tested, the fun answer is that they completely conceal loss on layer 2. As a side effect, they delay packets by sometimes huge amounts: Waiting for an ICMP echo reply can take a few hundred seconds (!), think trains in tunnels, but packets do arrive eventually. And what's true for ICMP is true for those protocols that produce the significant data volumes as well. I pity the poor TCP RTT estimator... --=20 Albert Rafetseder BSc. MSc. Member of Scientific Staff University of Vienna Faculty of Computer Science Research Group Future Communication (Endowed by A1 Telekom Austria AG) Waehringer Strasse 29/5.46, A-1090 Vienna, Austria T +43-1-42777-8620 albert.rafetseder@univie.ac.at http://www.cs.univie.ac.at/fc --=20 Albert Rafetseder BSc. MSc. Member of Scientific Staff University of Vienna Faculty of Computer Science Research Group Future Communication (Endowed by A1 Telekom Austria AG) Waehringer Strasse 29/5.46, A-1090 Vienna, Austria T +43-1-42777-8620 albert.rafetseder@univie.ac.at http://www.cs.univie.ac.at/fc