From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-iw0-f171.google.com (mail-iw0-f171.google.com [209.85.214.171]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority" (verified OK)) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 53049201A5C for ; Mon, 16 May 2011 06:35:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by iwn8 with SMTP id 8so5944452iwn.16 for ; Mon, 16 May 2011 06:45:04 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=3rfT6ehZ+H2EWpF4S0Moq7rUfuR5tGxf8vUHzgidiNA=; b=XKxr6GzakbENWt6jyrl8T5Q49VX3jKBSd5F2Amf6Gng/T4XdYaBBSYO9RqNeqdPNKq byLRVj4jK3CH+e9WvM/jJ5ndmvy2hOwgcLyqQhODxaJyBrN+ydebbuCIdW0vPJLlIDDG TC85vAzN+Qnu7Oft+h1480HMXaoIu9jf/I96I= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=gOZKC8ILwjnPX7Jm0z33tfaP05WAtA5HmI73a4LmHBtQqzX/9ZfD2TTpTwvzrabfT8 dit/S7gtCZvdYVT1N7nC5lUQQx4Uhxmdu175wpF2K8Yrw7VjOltROQl2UZCXWRa5lx+B YGbnRCZePIxIxNuVlmReykgL6aub/bJTZRakU= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.42.177.3 with SMTP id bg3mr1482430icb.359.1305553504017; Mon, 16 May 2011 06:45:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.31.201 with HTTP; Mon, 16 May 2011 06:45:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <-854731558634984958@unknownmsgid> References: <4DB70FDA.6000507@mti-systems.com> <4DC2C9D2.8040703@freedesktop.org> <20110505091046.3c73e067@nehalam> <6E25D2CF-D0F0-4C41-BABC-4AB0C00862A6@pnsol.com> <35D8AC71C7BF46E29CC3118AACD97FA6@srichardlxp2> <1304964368.8149.202.camel@tardy> <4DD9A464-8845-49AA-ADC4-A0D36D91AAEC@cisco.com> <1305297321.8149.549.camel@tardy> <8A928839-1D91-4F18-8252-F06BD004E37D@cisco.com> <5946BA6B-4E00-43AF-A8A2-17FB3769F37B@cisco.com> <2EEFB9D5-E9CC-4612-8D91-F6B382E3C2FB@gmail.com> <13672E5D-7EAE-446A-A8D8-BA85EF2CE72E@cisco.com> <4DD12520.8050604@freedesktop.org> <-854731558634984958@unknownmsgid> Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 07:45:03 -0600 Message-ID: From: Dave Taht To: Kevin Gross Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=90e6ba6e8e68d79bed04a364dc49 Cc: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net Subject: Re: [Bloat] Jumbo frames and LAN buffers X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 13:35:25 -0000 --90e6ba6e8e68d79bed04a364dc49 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 7:42 AM, Kevin Gross wrote: > I would like to try this. Can you suggest specific equipment to look at. > Due > to integration and low port count, most of the cheap consumer stuff has > surprisingly good layer-2 performance. I've tested a bunch of Linksys and > other small/medium business 5 to 24 port gigabit switches. Since I measur= e > latency, I expect I would have noticed if flow control were kicking in. > I would certainly appreciate more people looking at the switch in the wndr3700v2 we're using on the bismark project. I'm seeing some pretty deep buffering on it > > Kevin Gross > > -----Original Message----- > From: bloat-bounces@lists.bufferbloat.net > [mailto:bloat-bounces@lists.bufferbloat.net] On Behalf Of Jim Gettys > Sent: Monday, May 16, 2011 7:23 AM > To: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net > Subject: Re: [Bloat] Jumbo frames and LAN buffers > > On 05/16/2011 09:15 AM, Kevin Gross wrote: > > All the stand-alone switches I've looked at recently either do not > support > > 802.3x or support it in the (desireable) manner described in the last > > paragraph of the linked blog post. I don't believe Ethernet flow contro= l > is > > a factor in current LANs. I'd be interested to know the specifics if > anyone > > sees it differently. > > Heh. Plug wireshark into current off the shelf cheap consumer switches > intended for the home. You won't like what you see. And you have no > way to manage them. I was quite surprised last fall when doing my home > experiments to see 802.3 frames; I had been blissfully unaware of its > existence, and had to go read up on it as a result. > > I don't think any of the enterprise switches are so brain damaged. So i > suspect it's mostly lurking to cause trouble in home and small office > environments, exactly where no-one will know what's going on. > - Jim > > > > _______________________________________________ > Bloat mailing list > Bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bloat > --=20 Dave T=E4ht SKYPE: davetaht US Tel: 1-239-829-5608 http://the-edge.blogspot.com --90e6ba6e8e68d79bed04a364dc49 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 7:42 AM, Kevin G= ross <kevin.g= ross@avanw.com> wrote:
I would like to try this. Can you suggest specific equipment to look at. Du= e
to integration and low port count, most of the cheap consumer stuff has
surprisingly good layer-2 performance. I've tested a bunch of Linksys a= nd
other small/medium business 5 to 24 port gigabit switches. Since I measure<= br> latency, I expect I would have noticed if flow control were kicking in.
=

I would certainly appreciate more people looking at t= he switch in the wndr3700v2 we're using on the bismark project.

I'm seeing some pretty deep buffering on it

Kevin Gross

-----Original Message-----
From: bloat-bounces@= lists.bufferbloat.net
[mailto:bloat-bounce= s@lists.bufferbloat.net] On Behalf Of Jim Gettys
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2011 7:23 AM
To: bloat@= lists.bufferbloat.net
Subject: Re: [Bloat] Jumbo frames and LAN buffers

On 05/16/2011 09:15 AM, Kevin Gross wrote:
> All the stand-alone switches I've looked at recently either do not= support
> 802.3x or support it in the (desireable) manner described in the last<= br> > paragraph of the linked blog post. I don't believe Ethernet flow c= ontrol
is
> a factor in current LANs. I'd be interested to know the specifics = if
anyone
> sees it differently.

Heh. =A0Plug wireshark into current off the shelf cheap consumer switches intended for the home. =A0You won't like what you see. =A0And you have = no
way to manage them. =A0I was quite surprised last fall when doing my home experiments to see 802.3 frames; I had been blissfully unaware of its
existence, and had to go read up on it as a result.

I don't think any of the enterprise switches are so brain damaged. =A0S= o i
suspect it's mostly lurking to cause trouble in home and small office environments, exactly where no-one will know what's going on.
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 - Jim



___________________________________= ____________
Bloat mailing list
Bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net<= /a>
= https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bloat



--
Dave T=E4ht=
SKYPE: davetaht
US Tel: 1-239-829-5608
http://the-edge.blogspot.com
--90e6ba6e8e68d79bed04a364dc49--