From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-lf0-x22a.google.com (mail-lf0-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c07::22a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 557D13B29E for ; Fri, 22 Jun 2018 10:12:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-lf0-x22a.google.com with SMTP id z207-v6so9001704lff.9 for ; Fri, 22 Jun 2018 07:12:33 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=gavjoSPfvG8093oq5nd8We9Z3m33Ck9iAN9eXvole9o=; b=m2kHC1AppJqI6jr/yTHTXn4QHNfmCnKtZq4PeN2ZO4ki/agaeqWq826+1oKZLgbk7T dpNbD6X7wtXuYax2RWg2a+ItkKJ4wdz4i4jg01wc73uP2XFzFoJ4zDr37Av44S2KfNmu RHvg2MLAvj0vpTEM/WdlKE4xvbHaEP7ZR7b9RmoLOzYeS+nww59kyywWMMIHHLxhqvBw 2RXYI9dQPlaCPiMiOoufTuVT1RUaBCT/Aka6UGXtYDwM7vtPYHIa9WIDiWRPbrTjGhKH CxzOrCvEcNEkAIW3YRnfZpQYv+OP9+P2Owh/r+ix/tRQGsKSqy9BdAXhN9wH0/xwQ/q0 imkg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=gavjoSPfvG8093oq5nd8We9Z3m33Ck9iAN9eXvole9o=; b=HVTqLpaTBj05TZ1rPDLfys6Wszbn0p1t43BSxxfehOhUDRPyalpNLGoLiP1zybiWbt 9CEM1bMDSdgZv7z+gjNCQ1v2a9ny/4upJpF+fL/qaV3ve3A1Q26/c4OXfeLSr9gPFWVx lQHLboRnyByJI5nG7cfgH1/LcaP2bO5iz7QLWtrQGKY6Mmfvd3D5Oz5WIIpFK9FuqPvW EtQrPEyASQIBFifOzqOzBcpG5xEaZ/lMXJ4boFAC7+z1uRL7bOVFa8GN8RRMWN09Cy0H IItChmBVh7/tQx60cQBAb/4Evd/Yud1BIB26/asxIx8HADp5Vf9/UpH3TIAnur0rSnu9 d52g== X-Gm-Message-State: APt69E1v82SaPLZI9BcnAZD+Hy+EyQcfWYwy89clvBjkJht+7I1u8z1P kzpY7ILzKoh/wkI1L9gVzWoTTcBP X-Google-Smtp-Source: ADUXVKLcIB3V1IwL88l6WQqBsIkOEV8mL3RCOfV19oGys0o4VB35dvFwdwwnXQR/DZcwUakQQuyqWg== X-Received: by 2002:a19:d314:: with SMTP id k20-v6mr279132lfg.11.1529676752224; Fri, 22 Jun 2018 07:12:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.239.105] (83-245-237-65-nat-p.elisa-mobile.fi. [83.245.237.65]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id s5-v6sm1331132lji.46.2018.06.22.07.12.31 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 22 Jun 2018 07:12:31 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.4 \(3445.8.2\)) From: Jonathan Morton In-Reply-To: <9dbb8dc8-bec6-8252-c063-ff0ba5fd7c1a@pollere.com> Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2018 17:12:30 +0300 Cc: bloat Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <8736xgsdcp.fsf@toke.dk> <838b212e-7a8c-6139-1306-9e60bfda926b@gmail.com> <8f80b36b-ef81-eadc-6218-350132f4d56a@pollere.com> <9dbb8dc8-bec6-8252-c063-ff0ba5fd7c1a@pollere.com> To: Kathleen Nichols X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.8.2) Subject: Re: [Bloat] lwn.net's tcp small queues vs wifi aggregation solved X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2018 14:12:33 -0000 > On 22 Jun, 2018, at 5:01 pm, Kathleen Nichols = wrote: >=20 > Your original note was looking for a way > for finding out if the probability of seeing more data in the next = 10us > was sufficiently large to delay "a teeny bit" so that would be the > problem statement. I would instead frame the problem as "how can we get hardware to = incorporate extra packets, which arrive between the request and grant = phases of the MAC, into the same TXOP?" Then we no longer need to think = probabilistically, or induce unnecessary delay in the case that no = further packets arrive. - Jonathan Morton