From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-qt0-x22c.google.com (mail-qt0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c0d::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9C1DD3B2A4 for ; Fri, 3 Feb 2017 14:33:35 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail-qt0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id w20so45844451qtb.1 for ; Fri, 03 Feb 2017 11:33:35 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id:references :to; bh=J3N1sw84hNXz+6JCUf+sXGGyPCQrIPMBo2/NM8YZSw4=; b=ch68Y1DoxqEeLkCzgB3hTB1FvTLjBCusijEMs7jRL/QkLOxRssOZDzCe2poqaP4uF5 xt1YmTHgBySjtotJt1x4LgD9V9OyvQ3/UUQPypjJ0UMaqvYQ3cGFQH1Ro/qt7FsqCoYo 1OMOkOfFxgGnFsQCgiprRK+nZnee0N53ZpzVu+Zmauw/yDmT6IJCYnDyuk53OezIc/wj nZCYE5RWgMa3d3xydbNcypT1AXacbYjqbOrK05RbdS/v6YP3hiTDMqZeL4hSWe0ff6mr Q9Sk5VXXAvjHTrPIsEY+AAUL0FvixjHtvPZznQduqxQPLLNKo+Bty51Z9DfPYPBlWKuX 6pBA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :message-id:references:to; bh=J3N1sw84hNXz+6JCUf+sXGGyPCQrIPMBo2/NM8YZSw4=; b=sbtY2/0Gd02Bg843nbu/bgBTANaPiWXV6hYNYe7fSMK6AYCepC6CuW4+rX59pBeqBW PbRzb9oBlY3XZ9RaZzE5HjROmD35WUrFwZ00zD/ElsY48lJZdx2r/ikRfRr/2VNDH5JM 2re1roQ3CrQKOArhaH8I8Xf6WRQxlcfEQ4mFwBtoFxdFgbi+SQhB98T3uFCVvBFOs316 Qdwi3ebwrD6KHXnyWzGm58N5Jq19a/SkpJVafQP49aXByR/CocFToXyEFE+CKvj2lKLH EDxSIBnMXiXcd7VXJgXR5t+Erq9/C79/cZoPpJxHqLQ5VT8l6tmQ41AI7jKpSQLcEGzC U5+w== X-Gm-Message-State: AIkVDXKp6VlRG9rKJcdNlZBUj3gu3KqZBtbBBQA1xq4ecKScRC+i+hQVusNxpBGmWoGIxA== X-Received: by 10.200.57.199 with SMTP id v65mr14744935qte.13.1486150413162; Fri, 03 Feb 2017 11:33:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from richs-mbp-8270.lan (pool-64-222-232-85.port.east.myfairpoint.net. [64.222.232.85]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x40sm25145411qtx.23.2017.02.03.11.33.31 (version=TLS1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Fri, 03 Feb 2017 11:33:31 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_5DD71CAB-0BC6-4E06-B543-A5C26029E549" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 8.2 \(2104\)) From: Rich Brown In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 3 Feb 2017 14:33:30 -0500 Cc: bloat Message-Id: References: <18360404-E05A-4E0F-80E4-DB24056F8A2C@gmail.com> To: Jim Gettys X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.2104) Subject: Re: [Bloat] I wrote a blog entry about devices I know of out there... X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Feb 2017 19:33:35 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_5DD71CAB-0BC6-4E06-B543-A5C26029E549 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > On Feb 3, 2017, at 2:00 PM, Jim Gettys wrote: >=20 > On Fri, Feb 3, 2017 at 1:55 PM, Rich Brown > wrote: > Friends in town say that Fairpoint recommends a Zyxel VMG4380-B10A = modem for bonded pairs. They seem to have fairly good luck with it. >=20 > =E2=80=8BUnfortunately, the OpenWrt wiki says it has a Broadcom chip = in it: no open source driver the last I knew for them... While I = believe Broadcom sold off its wifi business and the recipient vendor = recently opened its driver (and there was a reverse engineered driver = already available), I don't believe the DSL chips had a similar change. >=20 > =E2=80=8B - Jim I'm a strong proponent of staying with vendor firmware on DSL equipment. = DSL is such a dicey technology, running on crummy copper lines, with = lots of odd protocol options, variations, etc (and ATM (?!)).=20 It gets hard to defend an outage/trouble report when they ask, "What = kind of modem do you have" and you start to tell them that you = hot-rodded the modem to use some lunatic firmware with anti-buffer-what? = :-) So I stick to using their modem. That goes double for a Zyxel that's = bonding two pairs: just plug the LEDE router's WAN Ethernet into it, and = the bits go in and out. Don't peer too closely at the man behind the = curtain/sausage being made. If they're not delivering anything close to = their promised/estimated speed, then you have cause to complain. In their defense, I will say that the Fairpoint techs on the support = lines are halfway (or quite) knowledgeable, and are supportive of either = of these cases: - I run my own router. - I put the DSL modem in bridge mode, and let the router supply PPPoE = credentials But letting Fairpoint-supplied equipment handle the physical link seems = good to me. My two cents... Rich --Apple-Mail=_5DD71CAB-0BC6-4E06-B543-A5C26029E549 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
On = Feb 3, 2017, at 2:00 PM, Jim Gettys <jg@freedesktop.org> = wrote:

On Fri, = Feb 3, 2017 at 1:55 PM, Rich Brown <richb.hanover@gmail.com> wrote:
Friends in town say = that Fairpoint recommends a Zyxel VMG4380-B10A modem for bonded pairs. = They seem to have fairly good luck with it.

=E2=80=8BUnfortunately, the = OpenWrt wiki says it has a Broadcom chip in it: no open source driver = the last I knew for them...  While I believe Broadcom sold off its = wifi business and the recipient vendor recently opened its driver (and = there was a reverse engineered driver already available), I don't = believe the DSL chips had a similar change.

=E2=80=8B   =                     =   - Jim

I'm a strong proponent of staying with vendor firmware = on DSL equipment. DSL is such a dicey technology, running on crummy = copper lines, with lots of odd protocol options, variations, etc (and = ATM (?!)). 

It = gets hard to defend an outage/trouble report when they ask, "What kind = of modem do you have" and you start to tell them that you hot-rodded the = modem to use some lunatic firmware with anti-buffer-what? :-)

So I stick to using = their modem. That goes double for a Zyxel that's bonding two pairs: just = plug the LEDE router's WAN Ethernet into it, and the bits go in and out. = Don't peer too closely at the man behind the curtain/sausage being made. = If they're not delivering anything close to their promised/estimated = speed, then you have cause to complain.

In their defense, I will say that the = Fairpoint techs on the support lines are halfway (or quite) = knowledgeable, and are supportive of either of these cases:

- I run my own = router.
- I put the DSL modem in bridge mode, and = let the router supply PPPoE credentials

But letting Fairpoint-supplied = equipment handle the physical link seems good to me.

My two = cents...

Rich

= --Apple-Mail=_5DD71CAB-0BC6-4E06-B543-A5C26029E549--