From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CE2F03B29E; Sat, 30 Nov 2019 17:17:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.217.116] (p548DC893.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [84.141.200.147]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 47QQjV3Hkzz10xx; Sat, 30 Nov 2019 23:17:34 +0100 (CET) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Carsten Bormann In-Reply-To: <385CF47C-17AD-4A62-9924-068E1485FFD5@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2019 23:17:33 +0100 Cc: Sebastian Moeller , ECN-Sane , bloat X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 596845051.817766-b3b0a6145b1ad507b2e9b9d39890ff6a Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <63E9C0E4-C913-4B2F-8AFC-64E12489BC65@gmail.com> <297503679.4519449.1575069001960@mail.yahoo.com> <54C976BC-DEC7-4710-9CFF-0243559D9002@gmail.com> <156EA284-C01D-4FAA-89F4-DB448795F7FC@gmx.de> <385CF47C-17AD-4A62-9924-068E1485FFD5@gmail.com> To: Jonathan Morton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Subject: Re: [Bloat] [Ecn-sane] sce materials from ietf X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2019 22:17:36 -0000 On Nov 30, 2019, at 15:32, Jonathan Morton = wrote: >=20 > There are unfortunate problems with introducing new TCP options, in = that some overzealous firewalls block traffic which uses them. This = would be a deployment hazard for SCE, which merely using a spare header = flag avoids. So instead we are still planning to use the spare bit - = which happens to be one that AccECN also uses, but AccECN negotiates in = such a way that SCE can safely use it even with an AccECN capable = partner. This got me curious: Do you have any evidence that firewalls are = friendlier to new flags than to new options? Gr=C3=BC=C3=9Fe, Carsten