From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-qk0-x22d.google.com (mail-qk0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c09::22d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DCD113B2A2 for ; Wed, 12 Oct 2016 23:22:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-qk0-x22d.google.com with SMTP id z190so64721810qkc.2 for ; Wed, 12 Oct 2016 20:22:33 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=2y0N2JwvievhduHqWpirMGL0buCUpoIliMSOeGDfjkc=; b=z2/9u0am1Nc0kOfhBjG+RnodsZpLC7kXct20zy22W3nUJVFuUYa1B+F/h+MD6WBpl6 +dpGgp5Uzyxk6dcS87zoZ/m/nYINb3SFuapkGC94+/OlpPw+tPzv28t1t0isetW2qund zf+CMo/WTrpQniipbFnAtbBFzCtbEBGUKSsOcIX/+GTYJe2qn2sT2Vr5L6KDBHKCeSCa k/U+kCi7hQRnZNd7bOBAFRWDxAQKmHAq/fMDuThH/2M9LD4RDq4f421p8E04+CFlqyH4 k91WAx/3X23g/PbE+0PhMd0SIvI/H8v7ARRwqH3kg5gBH7egGWNMvNOWTh1Ypm0ueeUY wD/w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=2y0N2JwvievhduHqWpirMGL0buCUpoIliMSOeGDfjkc=; b=dbYdlktv9iF9esvpMxlwuQQOboQ7qqR6pYUtoakRdvcgN2h+yjKEwbO4s22E0JFu+C q4pql7r/3bjVjqB/PZn0MsAMSbeKywwcPDA7YEDu5lnRX910mlMMOIWdh998HBqVB0EG kUFA9hHTXXVCQNHq5JbQNEit4N0sVZ5eG8XPtabrTD/mujV0bHxj13KIUBbfWcERPKng KoZEM4F2MwtxdbnQ/lp0lKbuUBF31c2fTwIWjl8zOM2uL8hl0oAQLYnLrDUJRb8T7dvJ 4K0AnxG87OMrI0laIta4rK1O8MZ+Y/IRPM9VZeO/BopDhc7rB/C6x5Mnp9sYhyh7AYk9 jsXA== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9RlwjeozyOvLxq/4jtQPhY193w5V+Z942Qf1qVDlO+wDSJtMorE6SWcOvX516s6LChoQjR8n8SOiOnQB9Q== X-Received: by 10.55.140.131 with SMTP id o125mr4166108qkd.17.1476328953450; Wed, 12 Oct 2016 20:22:33 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.12.146.164 with HTTP; Wed, 12 Oct 2016 20:22:32 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Dave Taht Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 20:22:32 -0700 Message-ID: To: jb Cc: bloat Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [Bloat] grading bloat better X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2016 03:22:33 -0000 Thank you very much for the explanation and the fix. I am confronted by the dsltestreports stuff every day on my search for bufferbloat. I don't consider it annoying, but as a chance to spot check! ... I still might quibble, but a trimmed mean makes more sense than just a mean= . Problem I always have is bloat is biased always towards the end of a test. = Here, at 1gbit, it took nearly 20 seconds to start going boom. Maybe we need to invent a new distribution (The bloat distribution? The TCP distribution)... You are getting towards a big dataset now. (has it been a year yet?) Got anyone lined up for a paper on it? I'd still love it if one day someone could take all the data you are filtering out, and plot that.... I imagine the user's test result is cached and not subject to these modifications? On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 5:57 PM, jb wrote: > It is done > under the trimmed mean method, that would be a "C" grade result. > > > > On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 11:46 AM, jb wrote: >> >> Actually I think the concept I need is the trimmed mean. >> throwing away the highest couple of values (lowest couple are not to be >> thrown away because they can't be errant). >> It isn't perfect but it would help. >> >> On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 11:39 AM, jb wrote: >>> >>> A while ago I changed from mean to median with the reasoning being that >>> one spike to a crazy level was not representative of bloat but instead >>> representative of a network stall or other anomaly. Graphs that were ne= arly >>> all good samples with one outlier were being unfairly graded poorly. >>> >>> But this example has the opposite issue - the median of this set of >>> samples is the first half where everything is ok. Hence the good score. >>> Using a mean would be correct for this sample. >>> What should happen is to throw away a couple (max) outliers first, then >>> do a mean to avoid punishing the results that come in as good but inclu= de >>> one errant measurement. >>> >>> thanks >>> -Justin >>> >>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 11:16 PM, Dave Taht wrote= : >>>> >>>> This has major bloat happening at the end of the upload test. Which >>>> worries me - here, at a gbit. >>>> >>>> http://www.dslreports.com/speedtest/5284047 >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Dave T=C3=A4ht >>>> Let's go make home routers and wifi faster! With better software! >>>> http://blog.cerowrt.org >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Bloat mailing list >>>> Bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net >>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bloat >>> >>> >> > --=20 Dave T=C3=A4ht Let's go make home routers and wifi faster! With better software! http://blog.cerowrt.org