From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-oi1-x22f.google.com (mail-oi1-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A007B3CB45 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 18:53:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-oi1-x22f.google.com with SMTP id 5614622812f47-3c70a53419eso2161691b6e.1 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 15:53:58 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=broadcom.com; s=google; t=1714431238; x=1715036038; darn=lists.bufferbloat.net; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=g4KJnN95m/bGMhmr58IDGsLmAJWHUbF4227b6Pg6/LA=; b=R7qthwQ/Bn3c2/XoyVBnEK1lOAtTmsrepqk/EPpK2fdt0ycCUSUk/MCtBAXUhvvI6D srknp5qOpy3zQKQD78Lj1ksmBm9hPuSnIGrdxcR7lfjjnitk8gxlgcd1bDuHuEaR9qz4 W4P8PSvSgL5YPbg/E4zIOMw/+b9rr5FsliJqU= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1714431238; x=1715036038; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=g4KJnN95m/bGMhmr58IDGsLmAJWHUbF4227b6Pg6/LA=; b=qaQFEVsdDPQhZxNCbxKPQ9VFHjUBZO1/pIBWVMzKQZI1zzRRGONQmWdstQSp8y2rNF QSH7AtjQ7XmKBvheY3ZzL0edJTu7Momw4+hZBEY3dLF6KW3eCTAc+zj8+oiaV5+O/aDz cwHklBZyex149QbZfQMUGWw0CuoCmdwo9SsBcmH70VovOQJHoQRQLhNhmoVb7uEFbMdt 8+Vo220dx+opk+MOC5yNAAXjnUy6YgqaB7LjbOh8VzBPSgEO6rH7W5eRqY9VR0HTlIWd GVi1g3uLmmCWuesPQouj7LFkF1Op1n8Evnn/rsVTXaBhehNExWSmaWk0FaXQyIs12B48 hi2g== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yx77ej5ccAbUWYWLlSyy2TtaNfYTRbRo3VHCWX+YunvW4earJcv Te5dFXacyZiuXrC+9Lk9UhmFf8kbsl5lgfF2eNcmOQATKzTjKWAPq/ezsVIldWBbQcx3aFAnir5 Q/ogxh4aNfngrFIcebPgpa6HJrBqeftCeQvNzwUTw1GGBE29FD0ZdIZvOWX7OhcNlRp91F39zQD 1b1rZuMoCdzE+Blgo5RytAmXD4 X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEd2DNU53YGLW+ZMFLGdllwMAvYX7aQDUijjF+hxMNufb3vFicnt3QpIbTV0WG41bl4Te0hnEqEbXbDIwD1/v0= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:10d4:b0:3c7:210a:bffe with SMTP id s20-20020a05680810d400b003c7210abffemr461479ois.12.1714431237678; Mon, 29 Apr 2024 15:53:57 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Bob McMahon Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2024 15:53:55 -0700 Message-ID: To: Dave Taht Cc: bloat , Dave Taht via Starlink , Make-Wifi-fast , libreqos , Cake List Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha-256; boundary="000000000000f148de06174420fc" Subject: Re: [Bloat] [Make-wifi-fast] waves podcast is out X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2024 22:53:58 -0000 --000000000000f148de06174420fc Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000ea155506174420a0" --000000000000ea155506174420a0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Fronthaul networks, preferably fiber, to a 20+ year concentrator (not a 802.3 switch) at the same location of an electrical panel. Get rid of the SoC and AP which is basically a Sun workstation with NICs and use remote radio heads (or in switch speak, port ASICs.) This design will work for 50+ years or the lifespan of most buildings. One and one. Best return on labor possible. The MTBF shorter lived parts are replaceable like light bulbs or sprinkler heads. Spectrum is not limited. Paul Baran pointed this out in 1994. Probably a good idea to stop with that property rights theory of limited spectrum. - Shorter range rf transceivers connected to fiber could produce a significant improvement - - tremendous improvement, really. - a mixture of terrestrial links plus shorter range radio links has the effect of increasing by orders and orders of magnitude the amount of frequency spectrum that can be made available. - By authorizing high power to support a few users to reach slightly longer distances we deprive ourselves of the opportunity to serve the ma= ny. - Communications systems can be built with 10dB ratio - Digital transmission when properly done allows a small signal to noise ratio to be used successfully to retrieve an error free signal. And, nev= er forget, any transmission capacity not used is wasted forever, like water over the dam. Not using such techniques represent lost opportunity. The solution isn't to shrink bw and increase range. Spacetime includes space and freespace pathloss works in favor with digital communications. Let'st stop blasting RF energy all over the place. We do this for water in irrigation systems already. Also, there are two optimums. The transport layer optimum and the link layer optimum. That's the core issue and the reason it's been "hard to fix" My $0.02, Bob On Mon, Apr 29, 2024 at 2:27=E2=80=AFPM Dave Taht via Make-wifi-fast < make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: > I did my usual bufferbloat rap on this pretty excellent podcast. What > I am most proud of however, > was showing off my mom=C2=B4s art in this segment here, including her mos= t > powerful piece "Sad Sam". > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DBVFWSyMp3xg&t=3D1098s > > -- > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DN0Tmvv5jJKs Epik Mellon Podcast > Dave T=C3=A4ht CSO, LibreQos > _______________________________________________ > Make-wifi-fast mailing list > Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast --=20 This electronic communication and the information and any files transmitted= =20 with it, or attached to it, are confidential and are intended solely for=20 the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and may contain= =20 information that is confidential, legally privileged, protected by privacy= =20 laws, or otherwise restricted from disclosure to anyone else. If you are=20 not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering the=20 e-mail to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use,=20 copying, distributing, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of= =20 this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you received this e-mail in error,= =20 please return the e-mail to the sender, delete it from your computer, and= =20 destroy any printed copy of it. --000000000000ea155506174420a0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Fronthaul=C2=A0networks, preferably=C2=A0fiber, to a 20+ y= ear concentrator (not a 802.3 switch) at the same location of an electrical= panel. Get rid of the SoC and AP which is basically a Sun workstation with= NICs and use remote radio heads (or in switch speak, port ASICs.)=C2=A0 Th= is design will work for 50+ years or the=C2=A0lifespan of most buildings. O= ne and one. Best return on labor possible. The MTBF shorter lived parts are= replaceable like light bulbs or sprinkler heads.

Spectrum is not li= mited.=C2=A0 Paul Baran pointed this out in 1994. Probably a good idea to s= top with that property=C2=A0rights theory of limited spectrum.
  • S= horter range rf transceivers connected to fiber could produce a significant= improvement - - tremendous improvement, really.
  • a mixture of terre= strial links plus shorter range radio links has the effect of increasing by= orders and orders of magnitude the amount of frequency spectrum that can b= e made available.
  • By authorizing high power to support a few users = to reach slightly longer distances we deprive ourselves of the opportunity = to serve the many.
  • Communications systems can be built with 10dB ra= tio
  • Digital transmission when properly done allows a small signal t= o noise ratio to be used successfully to retrieve an error free signal. And= , never forget, any transmission capacity not used is wasted forever, like = water over the dam. Not using such techniques represent lost opportunity.

The solution isn&= #39;t to shrink bw and increase range. Spacetime includes space and freespa= ce pathloss works in favor with digital communications. Let'st=C2=A0sto= p blasting RF energy all over the place. We do this for water in irrigation= =C2=A0systems already.=C2=A0
    Also, there are two opt= imums. The transport layer optimum and the link layer optimum. That's t= he core issue and the reason it's been "hard to fix"

    My $0.02,
    Bob
    <= br>

    On Mon, Apr 29, 2024 at 2:27=E2=80=AFPM Dave Taht via= Make-wifi-fast <make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
    I did my usual bufferbloat rap on this= pretty excellent podcast. What
    I am most proud of however,
    was showing off my mom=C2=B4s art in this segment here, including her most<= br> powerful piece "Sad Sam".

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DBVFWSyM= p3xg&t=3D1098s

    --
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DN0Tmvv5jJKs Epik = Mellon Podcast
    Dave T=C3=A4ht CSO, LibreQos
    _______________________________________________
    Make-wifi-fast mailing list
    M= ake-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
    https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wif= i-fast

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