From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Authentication-Results: mail.toke.dk; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com; arc=none (Message is not ARC signed); dmarc=pass (Used From Domain Record) header.from=gmail.com policy.dmarc=quarantine Received: from mail-ej1-x636.google.com (mail-ej1-x636.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::636]) by mail.toke.dk (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B71D070AF9E for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2025 23:11:26 +0200 (CEST) Received: by mail-ej1-x636.google.com with SMTP id a640c23a62f3a-b3e9d633b78so372585666b.1 for ; Mon, 29 Sep 2025 14:11:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1759180285; x=1759785085; darn=lists.bufferbloat.net; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=DLUPyyYXNlzOu8LJCsDlfwNlPFsXizHCICl0UYrIr9Q=; b=ebfX34aX0tWz+8jLLZALkHlkQsAFrBL2A4jcAXACePPpAIOvtftye1wJFxtkFH38CO lg+ugFJcpRTawzhZUqzBjOHtEOETFcALmIrvv4GfWxN6zMtLxafra9JwsrwB9P7gWvrY afiVIYHI2C44CGKBhkHMxc1HTWpBzZbj7SKDwmFzWVCG8k3dnLRkSE7ZX0OambWhotje pZ0u4DXsY10RaLTZSRua5MJ5nzNZat6H8aCesXqTH++Nw3VJPN+kwMVG3JanJdt33GZI NRA4wnsHrlKM4NIT93LbTgozZcDO7e59mpDMxGXLfrw06y/KEsEjVYoePm8J9ms7vQRX haYA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1759180285; x=1759785085; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=DLUPyyYXNlzOu8LJCsDlfwNlPFsXizHCICl0UYrIr9Q=; b=jOMaK+eBkMwDKSpAlT7fnPaXL8ZbbpgjCM9EKItbrw4CDEeO3FUY4g1488KJfCfphP Fmoqot0klbHed3huPTkpl6LsJrx3/Cu1c42mHwXBy0sLekDoRmMixOkbWWtJ6m6R2t1l u+yK43T+I9TjZrdcPKMU29FjhhCoaFsF6FuExXFq57mBusKu8bOWkF8WbLQJFe92BRyK MjYKap7x980OJgQ2V6pAKbevbWWMrMBZ3An5gQGjP1EJcc7R93+p8M4AsR2Jy0z+33ct yswIDihMCTys92+6TGqEgDBFuRvsmzc7sprEDwkHfQCRTbA9X6a7ojVP4P470Gy+SC4u jIbA== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCUlaPhaPTv5z731nVYU3Dv1u8KR8yO3BNeFmCOIuoKwpN8uXrPL0EWrvfgsj8edThEaHTjXVw==@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YxMvEE/rdni5/2GrPn5gXatcjCeiv2veFoDU4ZlpeYRazDuhyKN F3K0a4DR8DsAPbf64K/Ss44ZvPvEaFV73Q1WbmQICC5MwPmJL2J3c8Vdc+evcZFf4lha7W4cI4T hW7JKZOJR+aKZW6fjJSgm7VXm5g/LfKk= X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncvmFNRPavH9j6TgAz8luaXESrCGuNiKMjqhoVN6sx5VoPdQXnblRf8JLaF1lD4 nrAtiyS2b5EVdx4Z1YxAzqAsrzBbNYPWPEWlUZrwm4ijTBOqX71LZK33lX44lZS8reE1/tpkDOJ MN9mlBFtjQzrLfe8dvf6r0WdHuBrxC9bQFpT5efCq4IBXIZQcBSZX3mVT3FFnPnkks/ArGH+Npb V9aL0ms95LFm7QdauE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGWNjXkMW6IKrHWqLgSgRludTLh25GBaxdSUZHi+tENNEJyRQKuR780QooN0Z2zmmGsZazVrG+ZDuWgk/OIGHA= X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:8b9b:b0:b41:1d96:29d7 with SMTP id a640c23a62f3a-b413562151bmr190937366b.5.1759180284526; Mon, 29 Sep 2025 14:11:24 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <42638eb0-d2c4-41d5-8012-2e9a5da79a0b@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <42638eb0-d2c4-41d5-8012-2e9a5da79a0b@gmail.com> From: Frantisek Borsik Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2025 23:12:50 +0200 X-Gm-Features: AS18NWCZOfwWq1W4n2-7sR7zkvEyDlMIMWYGrSDqxf-QqJ63NnnESzrsNUHWcQM Message-ID: To: Inemesit Affia Cc: libreqos , Cake List , bloat , codel@lists.bufferbloat.net, Jeremy Austin via Rpm Message-ID-Hash: G5JFQDGOTOJ6XYUYJQMUZVPZLLDAMYRI X-Message-ID-Hash: G5JFQDGOTOJ6XYUYJQMUZVPZLLDAMYRI X-MailFrom: frantisek.borsik@gmail.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; loop; banned-address; emergency; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 3.3.10 X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.10 Precedence: list Subject: [Bloat] Re: [Starlink] Keynote: QoE/QoS - Bandwidth Is A Lie! at WISPAPALOOZA 2025 (October 16) List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: R29vZCBxdWVzdGlvbi4gU2FkbHksIG5vLiBJdCB0b29rIG1lIGxpdGVyYWxseSAzIHllYXJzIHRv IGdldCBXSVNQQSB0byBkbw0KdGhpcyBwYXJ0aWN1bGFyIHBhbmVsIHdpdGggYWxsIHRoZSBRb0Uv UW9TIGNvbXBhbmllcyBvbiBpdC4NCg0KTm93LCBteSBuZXh0IG1pc3Npb24gaXMgdG8gZ2V0IHRo ZW0gdG8gc3RyZWFtLCBvciBhdCBsZWFzdCwgcmVjb3JkLCBhbGwgdGhlDQpwYW5lbHMuDQoNCkJ1 dCB0ZWxsIHlvdSB3aGF0IC0gSSBoYXZlIHJlY29yZGVkIHRoZSBwYW5lbCBsYXN0IHllYXIgKHRo ZXJlIHdlcmUganVzdCAzDQpjb21wYW5pZXMsIG91dCBvZiA2LCBpbnZpdGVkLCB1bmZvcnR1bmF0 ZWx5KSBhbmQgaXQgd2FzIGp1c3QgbXkgb2xkZXINCmlQaG9uZSwgYnV0IGhlcmUgeW91IGFyZSwg aXQncyBzdGlsbCBnb29kIHRvIHdhdGNoOg0KaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cueW91dHViZS5jb20vd2F0Y2g/ dj1adXpJYVdHczlWaw0KDQpJIHdpbGwgdHJ5IHRvIGRvIGJldHRlciB0aGlzIHllYXIsIHdpdGgg ZXZlcnlvbmUgaW52b2x2ZWQgYXMgaXQgc2hvdWxkIGJlLA0KdGhlcmUgd2lsbCBiZSBhIGxvdCBv ZiBnb29kIHN0dWZmIHNoYXJlZC4NCg0KQWxsIHRoZSBiZXN0LA0KDQpGcmFuaw0KDQpGcmFudGlz ZWsgKEZyYW5rKSBCb3JzaWsNCg0KDQoqSW4gbG92aW5nIG1lbW9yeSBvZiBEYXZlIFTDpGh0OiAq MTk2NS0yMDI1DQoNCmh0dHBzOi8vbGlicmVxb3MuaW8vMjAyNS8wNC8wMS9pbi1sb3ZpbmctbWVt b3J5LW9mLWRhdmUvDQoNCg0KaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubGlua2VkaW4uY29tL2luL2ZyYW50aXNla2Jv cnNpaw0KDQpTaWduYWwsIFRlbGVncmFtLCBXaGF0c0FwcDogKzQyMTkxOTQxNjcxNA0KDQppTWVz c2FnZSwgbW9iaWxlOiArNDIwNzc1MjMwODg1DQoNClNreXBlOiBjYXNpb2E1MzAyY2ENCg0KZnJh bnRpc2VrLmJvcnNpa0BnbWFpbC5jb20NCg0KDQpPbiBNb24sIFNlcCAyOSwgMjAyNSBhdCAxMTow NOKAr1BNIEluZW1lc2l0IEFmZmlhIDxpbmVtZXNpdGFmZmlhQGdtYWlsLmNvbT4NCndyb3RlOg0K DQo+IFdpbGwgd2UgaGF2ZSBhY2Nlc3MgdG8gbGl2ZSB2aWRlby9yZWNvcmRpbmc/DQo+DQo+IFNl cCAyOSwgMjAyNSA5OjU5OjMzIFBNIEZyYW50aXNlayBCb3JzaWsgdmlhIFN0YXJsaW5rIDwNCj4g c3RhcmxpbmtAbGlzdHMuYnVmZmVyYmxvYXQubmV0PjoNCj4NCj4gSGVsbG8gdG8gYWxsLA0KPg0K PiBJIHdpbGwgYmUgbW9kZXJhdGluZyBhIGRpc2N1c3Npb24gcGFuZWwgIktleW5vdGU6IFFvRS9R b1MgLSBCYW5kd2lkdGggSXMgQQ0KPiBMaWUhIiBhdCBXSVNQQVBBTE9PWkEgMjAyNSBpbiBMYXMg VmVnYXMsIE5ldmFkYSwgb24gVGh1cnNkYXksIE9jdG9iZXIgMTYsDQo+IGF0IDlBTSBQRFQuDQo+ DQo+DQo+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3Lndpc3BhZXZlbnRzLm9yZy9XUEFMT09aQTI1L3Nlc3Npb24vMzAw NzQ5NC9rZXlub3RlLXFvZXFvcy1iYW5kd2lkdGgtaXMtYS1saWUNCj4NCj4gLi4ud2l0aCBldmVy eWJvZHkgcmVsZXZhbnQgaW4gdGhpcyBnYW1lOg0KPg0KPiAqQXBwTG9naWMgTmV0d29ya3MqIChm b3JtZXJseSBTYW5kdmluZSkgd2lsbCBiZSByZXByZXNlbnRlZCBieSBpdHMgQ1RPLA0KPiBBbGV4 YW5kZXIgSGF2w6RuZywgKkJlcXVhbnQgKmJ5IGl0cyBDRU8gYW5kIENvLUZvdW5kZXIsIEpvc2Ug TG9wZXosDQo+ICpDYW1iaXVtDQo+IE5ldHdvcmtzKiBieSBpdHMgU2VuaW9yIERpcmVjdG9yIG9m IEVuZ2luZWVyaW5nLCBEbWl0cnkgTW9pc2VldiwgKlBhcmFxdW0NCj4gVGVjaG5vbG9naWVzKiBi eSBpdHMgRm91bmRlci9DRU8vRGlyZWN0b3IsIEFqaXRoIFBhc3F1YWwsICpQcmVzZWVtKiAoQnkN Cj4gQXRlcmxvIE5ldHdvcmtzKSBieSBpdHMgRm91bmRlciBhbmQgQ2hpZWYgUHJvZHVjdCBPZmZp Y2VyLCBEYW4gU2llbW9uIGFuZA0KPiBsYXN0IGJ1dCBub3QgbGVhc3QsICpMaWJyZVFvUyogd2ls bCBiZSByZXByZXNlbnRlZCBieSBvdXIgQ2hpZWYgUHJvZHVjdA0KPiBPZmZpY2VyLCBIZXJiZXJ0 IFdvbHZlcnNvbi4NCj4NCj4gSXQgd2FzLCBvYnZpb3VzbHksIHJlc2VydmVkIHRvIG91ciBiZWxv dmVkIERhdmUgVMOkaHQsIGJ1dCBJIHdhcyBmb3JjZWQgdG8NCj4gcGljayBpdCB1cCBpbnN0ZWFk IG9mIGhpbS4uLmJ5IHRoZSBjaXJjdW1zdGFuY2VzLg0KPg0KPiAqSG9wZSB0byBzZWUgYXQgbGVh c3Qgc29tZSBvZiB5b3UgaW4gTGFzIFZlZ2FzIC0gd2Ugd2lsbCBiZSBhdCB0aGUgYm9vdGgNCj4g IzYzMCEqDQo+DQo+IEFsbCB0aGUgYmVzdCwNCj4NCj4gRnJhbmsNCj4NCj4gRnJhbnRpc2VrIChG cmFuaykgQm9yc2lrDQo+DQo+DQo+ICpJbiBsb3ZpbmcgbWVtb3J5IG9mIERhdmUgVMOkaHQ6ICox OTY1LTIwMjUNCj4NCj4gaHR0cHM6Ly9saWJyZXFvcy5pby8yMDI1LzA0LzAxL2luLWxvdmluZy1t ZW1vcnktb2YtZGF2ZS8NCj4NCj4NCj4gaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubGlua2VkaW4uY29tL2luL2ZyYW50 aXNla2JvcnNpaw0KPg0KPiBTaWduYWwsIFRlbGVncmFtLCBXaGF0c0FwcDogKzQyMTkxOTQxNjcx NA0KPg0KPiBpTWVzc2FnZSwgbW9iaWxlOiArNDIwNzc1MjMwODg1DQo+DQo+IFNreXBlOiBjYXNp b2E1MzAyY2ENCj4NCj4gZnJhbnRpc2VrLmJvcnNpa0BnbWFpbC5jb20NCj4gX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCj4gU3RhcmxpbmsgbWFpbGluZyBs aXN0IC0tIHN0YXJsaW5rQGxpc3RzLmJ1ZmZlcmJsb2F0Lm5ldA0KPiBUbyB1bnN1YnNjcmliZSBz ZW5kIGFuIGVtYWlsIHRvIHN0YXJsaW5rLWxlYXZlQGxpc3RzLmJ1ZmZlcmJsb2F0Lm5ldA0KPg0K Pg0K