From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-io0-x229.google.com (mail-io0-x229.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c06::229]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6E26F3B29E for ; Mon, 4 Jun 2018 14:22:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-io0-x229.google.com with SMTP id s26-v6so102244ioj.4 for ; Mon, 04 Jun 2018 11:22:24 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=EQn7SCU+Kk71b0hZWm7oySfIdcer8OgnhCi+HvxMCSI=; b=Fpfn/HhiafdaliowgU9IFa3+gE5+/oRcoMAUOZyh5sAT+15yZaDtwS0ASWo4YuRnTk GQO6ssHG2weQJMYNLUwtzkx6I0u7X2k4jYaHiOm8bZPpIYKlcD3QJw6Vc2qhRYEjgxU4 sGHMJArcndtDzVpWz6x9O62cPq8EB4js/AGcC0J1g4AuuKyPoLDTsJaaNswvpW2/3j6A qfAitBkROtEQ0Xe/95wL3TLWK+ClTpSM/VBMoZE5MsJsYll6eWRHQf/FS62IIbxQTaL3 hJ01br2rFUYDQKqk/7pRxIeWs0jyk1ZNJGC5+srxXaGPB+iKZJYI/8F+SU5cd1hUKa4G sUAg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=EQn7SCU+Kk71b0hZWm7oySfIdcer8OgnhCi+HvxMCSI=; b=eEYcoMHnZS8bNSTk3pv5PLpX0RdxEzN8ccFnFTPKglXC1RAtmvvgMQCs7hSCJhWiqM AGn2nMZmIoPvU1YQa54Ovwb6VC172fUhffIu7ctnPGvfTV68BYeWpVvYhku+UKFmrT+U 9k9uVG6xi0hKYCu7dLncQi2xSoDYh0RYFQg1ZFMSHvgLczKu3Dnc7ATvkBBSdQhUnbHw iWllKCWV5wkKuoynCvgETNKKTVwJMJ029sB7Vovkvx5DR3cnMDuVB9ucK6T/HUVBSABV 5hUJLLYcmfM03ihC2hWpzb/lHA45IOHU4KN1Una7KTAsb72U1/VwaJExHbxkSW6t0eVP MSnA== X-Gm-Message-State: APt69E2wZT9HWCDnO9D1ERdG5rFNgvI5RfAYNnQ/3x8DbBU5LbdEp1OI 51Lhq6S1WO4vSsft5NNlPyW4WRHWsmCTu9u29SQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ADUXVKKW7BFq9lf6td0UcwTMVfSUd7ELL9EHyS9fKlBO721ihsj7xyg2LILZ7ejjkEw7l6e3VMIrGHOhdVVw0lLaNfY= X-Received: by 2002:a6b:2252:: with SMTP id i79-v6mr10153578ioi.276.1528136543873; Mon, 04 Jun 2018 11:22:23 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 2002:a02:a00a:0:0:0:0:0 with HTTP; Mon, 4 Jun 2018 11:22:23 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <152717340941.28154.812883711295847116.malone@soybean.canonical.com> <4f67f9b3-05a1-8d15-0aee-dfe8ea730d7c@gmail.com> <73c25a21-0ace-b5ee-090e-d06fb3b8dc60@kit.edu> From: =?UTF-8?Q?Jonas_M=C3=A5rtensson?= Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2018 20:22:23 +0200 Message-ID: To: Dave Taht Cc: "Bless, Roland (TM)" , bloat Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000ddb1d7056dd50367" Subject: Re: [Bloat] Fwd: [Bug 1436945] Re: devel: consider fq_codel as the default qdisc for networking X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2018 18:22:24 -0000 --000000000000ddb1d7056dd50367 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Speaking about systemd defaults, they just enabled ecn for outgoing connections: https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/9143 /Jonas On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 7:08 PM, Dave Taht wrote: > On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 6:16 AM, Jonas M=C3=A5rtensson > wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 1:28 PM, Bless, Roland (TM) > > > wrote: > >> > >> Hi, > >> > >> Am 24.05.2018 um 17:38 schrieb Jan Ceuleers: > >> > Took 3 years after Dave approached them, but Ubuntu is finally > adopting > >> > fq_codel as the default qdisc. > >> > >> Yes, if the Linux kernel is forwarding packets it makes a lot of sense= , > >> but I don't understand why it make sense for ordinary end-systems. > >> Didn't Byte Queue Limits (BQL) suffice? Just curious... > > > > > > Actually, for a long time now the codel wiki has recommended using sch_= fq > > instead of fq_codel for servers. > > That recommendation predates the tcp pacing change you note below. > > I'm pretty convinced fq_codel is now the best all around "default" > qdisc, and we should rework our recomendation. > > > It seems Ubuntu defaulting to fq_codel is a result of using systemd whi= ch > > adopted it as default almost 4 years ago. There was a request to change > the > > default in systemd from fq_codel to sch_fq in order to support pacing b= ut > > the issue was closed when tcp internal pacing was introduced in linux > 4.13: > > > > https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/5090 > > > > /Jonas > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Bloat mailing list > > Bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net > > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bloat > > > > > > -- > > Dave T=C3=A4ht > CEO, TekLibre, LLC > http://www.teklibre.com > Tel: 1-669-226-2619 > --000000000000ddb1d7056dd50367 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Speaking about systemd defaults, they just enabled ecn for= outgoing connections:


/Jonas
On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 7:08 PM, Dave Taht <d= ave.taht@gmail.com> wrote:
= On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 6:16 AM, Jonas M=C3=A5rtensson
<martensson.jonas@gmail.co= m> wrote:
>
>
> On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 1:28 PM, Bless, Roland (TM) <roland.bless@kit.edu>
> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Am 24.05.2018 um 17:38 schrieb Jan Ceuleers:
>> > Took 3 years after Dave approached them, but Ubuntu is finall= y adopting
>> > fq_codel as the default qdisc.
>>
>> Yes, if the Linux kernel is forwarding packets it makes a lot of s= ense,
>> but I don't understand why it make sense for ordinary end-syst= ems.
>> Didn't Byte Queue Limits (BQL) suffice? Just curious...
>
>
> Actually, for a long time now the codel wiki has recommended using sch= _fq
> instead of fq_codel for servers.

That recommendation predates the tcp pacing change you note below.
I'm pretty convinced fq_codel is now the best all around "default&= quot;
qdisc, and we should rework our recomendation.

> It seems Ubuntu defaulting to fq_codel is a result of using systemd wh= ich
> adopted it as default almost 4 years ago. There was a request to chang= e the
> default in systemd from fq_codel to sch_fq in order to support pacing = but
> the issue was closed when tcp internal pacing was introduced in linux = 4.13:
>
> https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/50= 90
>
> /Jonas
>
> _______________________= ________________________
> Bloat mailing list
> Bloat@lists.bufferbloat= .net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bloat
>



--

Dave T=C3=A4ht
CEO, TekLibre, LLC
ht= tp://www.teklibre.com
Tel: 1-669-226-2619

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