From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-lj1-x22f.google.com (mail-lj1-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 95BEB3CB35 for ; Mon, 4 May 2020 10:24:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-lj1-x22f.google.com with SMTP id f18so9806604lja.13 for ; Mon, 04 May 2020 07:24:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=glfj46B354ecEvLcI/CHMul4JX24rDKE0MgcmXt2h20=; b=PzUxkhUuIor2NKcZSLGL/Jx19gGEdrdBRdBpHY6Ygf/oU51tYwzSi1Wpl5E3CvOW4U wwdfWm4rZzU4jK5N9QNZPcqw7xnv+dB2yxwnTOnJRJTsrZHRxG53gBsVP0CFdLGkG1dM ar79Oect1SA7baebls+HOSWH4Cl8FFex0U+47+vzZxsGM00nyeqnnG1J9kObQfR+AQrJ 7HkahPDDcJONroyEMSTr4n/QktjPZ3DpwNosLvrG3ifchD8ndtakZKSt7dG+VLDeDncn 3S6Mynr4kCbAxsSMniRog6oicrWhTpslJNkxnKIcfMeq6jo5ofSlcFHszbtpWkdVGl5d ytRw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=glfj46B354ecEvLcI/CHMul4JX24rDKE0MgcmXt2h20=; b=RadOWR9oYKc+NrOfafGnEI/mzTbI3XY8ywQe6tSPvQDvQ0UIbkjRr/3WvTYJ5K4x5l G6O6Ta5cBTrJmsiA0oIobnDNLMMBHuCw460lZ3I74XHvCk49A5q7bSsTGB6ix/vC+sKj eopgBdhBvELW2nF1lIJI2h++BW6waCeMsgVUF9UXK3Oendgt0d3+huw+rMuBBnjuucQ3 yXI2iClov3WGN54bMe/EmoaAxd6zRDXrvU/tds7TEKEbafDpd0q+ZFpfBHQSW7RA2yWZ hPD+fBrinaVnKYfsL5blbDJW+WF50Z7NMQ4pft3WxAjEPp0ywXHCktyx+wYB/9tOhLnA fdWg== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuZvQ/aX4DCvtZvfAnFE+m/pe15ZJZKA9/Q1AjwUyoZenhBYIRQ1 u+DKmF+AeDbWfc1UZUUL2nY= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypIIBLYRrpKubdjg9TSl9RCoUvBCs+U6JWAX+fxMYzACYY1RlJzMmk0v1mCmEOUOwJvafcoRtQ== X-Received: by 2002:a2e:9713:: with SMTP id r19mr10694609lji.89.1588602240365; Mon, 04 May 2020 07:24:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jonathartonsmbp.lan (83-245-235-192-nat-p.elisa-mobile.fi. [83.245.235.192]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id l124sm2464077lfd.11.2020.05.04.07.23.57 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 04 May 2020 07:23:59 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Jonathan Morton In-Reply-To: <9FB134D9-B180-4975-A2A4-1840F1232359@gmx.de> Date: Mon, 4 May 2020 17:23:55 +0300 Cc: =?utf-8?Q?Richard_Fr=C3=B6hning?= , bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20200504142626.1104b959@lake.home.lan> <9FB134D9-B180-4975-A2A4-1840F1232359@gmx.de> To: Sebastian Moeller X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Subject: Re: [Bloat] Does it makes sense to shape traffic with 16Kbit/s up and 16Kbit/s down? X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 May 2020 14:24:01 -0000 > On 4 May, 2020, at 5:09 pm, Sebastian Moeller wrote: >=20 > At 16Kbps a full-MTU sized packet will take around > (1000 ms/sec * (1500 * 8) bits/packet ) / 16000 bits/sec =3D 750 ms >=20 > This is just to put things into perspective, 16Kbps is going to be = both painful and much better than no service at all.... Reducing the MTU to 576 bytes is likely to help. That was commonly done = in the days of analogue modems, when such low speeds were normal. I'm fortunate enough to live somewhere where the local ISPs don't limit = your data transfer, even on the budget subscriptions. Roughly =E2=82=AC25= will buy you 500Kbps mobile service for three months, and you can use = that 500Kbps as much as you like. And that is with the lowest = population density in Europe, so the per capita cost of covering the = country in cell towers is obviously no excuse. - Jonathan Morton=