From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp104.iad3a.emailsrvr.com (smtp104.iad3a.emailsrvr.com [173.203.187.104]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B7F3F3B260 for ; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 12:16:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp6.relay.iad3a.emailsrvr.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp6.relay.iad3a.emailsrvr.com (SMTP Server) with ESMTP id 7F5E66AB0; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 12:16:36 -0500 (EST) X-Auth-ID: jf@jonathanfoulkes.com Received: by smtp6.relay.iad3a.emailsrvr.com (Authenticated sender: jf-AT-jonathanfoulkes.com) with ESMTPSA id 4CB455E44; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 12:16:36 -0500 (EST) X-Sender-Id: jf@jonathanfoulkes.com Received: from jonathans-mbp.lan (h75.168.20.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net [98.20.168.75]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384) by 0.0.0.0:587 (trex/5.7.12); Mon, 28 Nov 2016 12:16:36 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 10.1 \(3251\)) From: Jonathan Foulkes In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 12:16:35 -0500 Cc: bloat Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: To: Dave Taht X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3251) Subject: Re: [Bloat] COTS router with OpenWrt X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 17:16:36 -0000 Hi Dave, a special thanks to you for all the cheerleading and pushing = you do on this topic. > I hope that your marketing campaign is being successful on these > fronts. It has always been my goal to "enable better products", but > not have the headache of making them myself, where 99.99% of the > effort is (like in cerowrt), in making everything else "just work" and > be reliable enough to ship. I haven=E2=80=99t ramped up the marketing in a big way yet, but what I = am doing is quite effective (e.g. click through metrics are 5 to 10x the = norm); what=E2=80=99s been most astonishing is the word of mouth spread. Yes, lots of effort in having a reliable, supportable product.=20 As you can see from the site, my messaging has been focused on regular = end users, using terminology they can hopefully grasp (I get accused of = both being too technical and not technical enough, so maybe I got it = right ;-) One area of messaging that I believe members of this list could provide = input on is around how to get people to understand that =E2=80=98speed=E2=80= =99 (line capacity) is not everything. I keep looking for ways to = address that and wrote a short post on it: = http://evenroute.com/the-last-50-feet/quick-vs-fast I=E2=80=99ll post more thoughts on the other thread you started. - Jonathan > On Nov 28, 2016, at 10:57 AM, Dave Taht wrote: >=20 > On Mon, Nov 28, 2016 at 7:21 AM, Jonathan Foulkes > wrote: >> Thanks for the Introduction Rich, and thanks again to you and many = others on this list for all your contributions over the years helping to = combat bloat. >>=20 >> This product was born of my own frustration with finding a way to = help neighbors and family get a simple off-the-shelf solution that even = non-technical users can deploy. >=20 > I hope that your marketing campaign is being successful on these > fronts. It has always been my goal to "enable better products", but > not have the headache of making them myself, where 99.99% of the > effort is (like in cerowrt), in making everything else "just work" and > be reliable enough to ship. >=20 >>=20 >> I look forward to participating more actively on this list. >=20 > One of my thoughts has been since it has become so difficult in the > USA for an open source organization to achieve 501c3 status (icei.org > is now 5 years into their attempt) was to go the 501c6 route, like the > linux foundation. We now have a reasonable set of companies doing the > right things for queueing, updates, and so on, that perhaps banding > together to promote "less lag, regular updates" would be a way to > support some of the other costs of this effort, such as effective > outreach. >=20 >>=20 >> Jonathan >>=20 >>> On Nov 26, 2016, at 9:08 AM, Rich Brown = wrote: >>>=20 >>> I have been exchanging a few emails with Jonathan Foulkes from = evenroute.com. He tells me that his company is installing OpenWrt on a = commercial, off the shelf (COTS) TP-Link router and selling them on = commercially. His "secret sauce" is an auto-update facility and improved = setup software, which includes a rate-detection step that operates = continually to adjust the fq_codel parameters to the actual line rate. = You can take a look at IQrouter.com, or look them up on Amazon. >>>=20 >>> This might be a solution to our current conundrum about not having = an easy solution that solves our family's networking problem. I'm going = to get one of these and try it out. >>>=20 >>> He has been following our bufferbloat and make-fifi-fast work = closely, as well as the work on LEDE, which he'll consider once it hits = a stable point. I have invited him to join this list. >>>=20 >>> Welcome, Jonathan. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Bloat mailing list >> Bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bloat >=20 >=20 >=20 > --=20 > Dave T=C3=A4ht > Let's go make home routers and wifi faster! With better software! > http://blog.cerowrt.org