From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.20]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A44D63B29E for ; Sat, 25 Apr 2020 12:22:29 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1587831744; bh=rK2InvItXK/LsM39GXhk+hicvDz+K674EOePbn7vT4I=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Date:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:To:From; b=jDBbBqjJ+wYMHkw8tT/tT6eBGiZOvrikVXxj5SgWZAoECC92qGktxzuvT/eIdaKXc qB70P53PT0SusP29sS/Q6Tip5VqNznNPaqOoAs4K3Xvmr5WW9vhZT0K6kc/k93s3ga 1Pu8DRIyngCObkDu0Dy54T0ysBgolLSi/KtepkhM= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.42.160] ([77.3.105.206]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx104 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1M42jQ-1jSNZP2ecy-00027V; Sat, 25 Apr 2020 18:22:23 +0200 Date: Sat, 25 Apr 2020 18:22:22 +0200 User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: <72d4d4a4-ad29-cdd8-0bf5-2413c7c845de@sewingwitch.com> References: <431A84397F3D9C1EB097BCCE@[172.27.17.193]> <6F1F3C646A7DFD2CC8C9E79E@172.27.17.193> <0B51625096F92AF18CD397D9@[172.27.17.193]> <8f4566dd-def0-cd97-45db-577784f90efd@sewingwitch.com> <9FDDBB5C-68CF-45B1-85D8-3A7BD6CB9F31@gmail.com> <3D2F4A70BAB1774D1EFDC641@[172.27.17.193]> <025E1E0E1D49D3C95FFD4035@[172.27.17.193]> <03E39523-C125-4A03-A514-30CA4E361225@gmail.com> <72d4d4a4-ad29-cdd8-0bf5-2413c7c845de@sewingwitch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----5C8R290X5PZ48KNL1P8H7LP9YK8OJJ" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net, Kenneth Porter , bloat From: Sebastian Moeller Message-ID: X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:eEvhXpC2qLulTpfWOMyJZEpkD3lzKvJb27AU8VdXxwAMYVk8Q1a QTE5TZk+HZ6JaZVofr0Z2YWhbMSZEkAK6iBvKYROWr8MH1VP2r0r5/dnweZSj1TIgx2Dph3 QO0+WVWguFeY5X9VnGsnbwd3asGQ+CuZ//+Xa29cTVdtG8X7IjgSQ3VoYehrKflbskK4VqE 5F7ajkrLK3vkfTObAnaYg== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:5uoBNieEbuY=:nqPrR5RSoYmGG7ddiGejEL x4xPhiIHwkh74T7PPn3E9lrIxayPwnAGGE9Wjcs8YHkuXUDBC83Hq70euLSBnaM7AvfpXgcnq WzYua//rp4K2BV3tUmCqcaVsaAU5ydtvWiFc0C6//PsDtIbBT4P8F4fRgCU11dJsfzMoeYoHO bWCopymW9tJdTND8+r+2n7EEMTKhMzOlS4xXJvdBD9fguO0rAw+rKKeNATvDS1vP3Rnm6dYQQ RL2vLsIYh8P2Ej4XD+rO1uagb9DegZ+7iTF1DpCcjEsHECsZ5CKaG5OkCcFTs2/1gaDQ6q3/z yjfMzoF0/1GfDYbVz8vtIz1u80hk1XAsIMewZyI4pMFMu41OK/hMoFCm9VtvX2wLz3cRsIjcQ obUsnHpvOD94tCwjAJrpszgznXhuz8FKQ4drRo7US6vLaqHVenemtwV1hne7nI2KwhUQGHw5/ hqrOJ7H0Q6cYEOV8/tjeK7gyBjBZx/w3lYICmnjXC6Y4gy1C78gC+cFPgHPjSYFo/H4nkVvQ6 6ccTXrg/rWQZye0kpT85rnSlQ3BjFkvrtCR+fVbFlihYrzapfKEl2Y2KGW3CbzGdVpfKfWsL0 6py6tTghXEVOvv8beDDUZpznGL0kxRLBflFF/5gTs7GzxLXrG2vNhMUtWCwEsAN9zpV3ynhnW PaUSQRHmk5pWROhmY8KrQEUkhXcraEXNg50nvT5OwtTVP+XlqC/fx/7lUgq1klkvhXBf8+cE1 cA8d6QEEHZm7ilZfIXL3mVo9PAymYDnqyI4ZwmU7HaoGYhULIsGCzrnFI2AzX01Ho+/XjAL9o fCPYkHZSISx5NIZ9V2I7S8jYeoDzVidnEPt4j8njp3n973fyPZp+ezm4bTZGAVPEzEdeT2AfQ qPJgliFk4yk2jxeC30C2PokkBdruAajR4zHAtDkto2fqxedA2ZBVtn5HHRkaIZNJr9/aGYQPo 2WTlzT5jmKC1M9Hj515NEzi7dIIfgtC5jzzJ/dLwD/pmKpwrtQm6j/CNYmV7RaYSiwcHEP5oQ NXzKoOqIGs5tu3ZpXzVXCRLOOpAmsz1t7m2g3vRnTedztXKM0oNS3IUZ83Lxp2NvfswkFvpSp VSA8aK16V3f1pTu5iMTpVN+0liqIGPwGw5XRCXH3QDdy2n/kQMU93P941JGn+3pgY6mnuQYbL nLOza/Imej865wLfbto/mpljNARS5UlnIp04Fb+u2MQ1D6uasSNJwQHAg8wP5VtrcO2yQKPZW tC5fM1YJNq4CEjJgE Subject: Re: [Bloat] this explains speedtest stuff X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 25 Apr 2020 16:22:30 -0000 ------5C8R290X5PZ48KNL1P8H7LP9YK8OJJ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Ken, I tried to summarize a few recommendations under https://forum=2Eopenwrt= =2Eorg/t/sqm-qos-recommended-settings-for-the-dslreports-speedtest-bufferbl= oat-testing/2803 maybe that is of some help=2E=2E=2E Good luck Sebastian On 25 April 2020 17:59:47 CEST, Kenneth Porter w= rote: >On 4/25/2020 8:43 AM, Dave Taht wrote: >> and the last flaw of this test series is that ken took the dslreports >> "fiber" setting for the dslreports test as "The right thing"=2E the >> "fiber" test is structured to stress test an asymmetric 1gbit/100mbit >> connection, not a shaped fiber connection running at 50mbit >symmetric=2E >> The number of uploads is 4, downloads, 32=2E=2E=2E=2E it's totally ok t= o pick >> a given fiber/cable/whatever test, but it does help to apply the same >> characteristics to more of the tests you do, if you are trying to >> compare technologies=2E > >I'd be happy to test with a different set of speed test settings=2E Would > >Corporate/Edu be a better choice? > >In going through this exercise, I can imagine someone saying "where'd=20 >all the bandwidth I paid for go?" as we trade bandwidth for reduced=20 >latency=2E How do you sell that to end users? ISPs have trained people to > >think only in terms of raw speed (obviously that's best for an ISP's=20 >bottom line as they can upsell you the higher-priced package) and most=20 >people (outside of gamers) don't really grasp latency with the=20 >intuitiveness of speed=2E Maybe we need some Youtube videos showing end= =20 >user experiences of the benefit of reduced latency=2E > > >_______________________________________________ >Bloat mailing list >Bloat@lists=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet >https://lists=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet/listinfo/bloat --=20 Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail=2E Please excuse my brevity=2E ------5C8R290X5PZ48KNL1P8H7LP9YK8OJJ Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Ken,

I tried to summarize a few recommen= dations under https://f= orum=2Eopenwrt=2Eorg/t/sqm-qos-recommended-settings-for-the-dslreports-spee= dtest-bufferbloat-testing/2803 maybe that is of some help=2E=2E=2E
<= br>Good luck
Sebastian

On 25 A= pril 2020 17:59:47 CEST, Kenneth Porter <shiva@sewingwitch=2Ecom> wro= te:
On 4/25/2020 8:43 AM, Dave Taht wrote:
and the last flaw of this test serie=
s is that ken took the dslreports
"fiber" setting for the dslreports tes=
t as "The right thing"=2E the
"fiber" test is structured to stress test =
an asymmetric 1gbit/100mbit
connection, not a shaped fiber connection ru=
nning at 50mbit symmetric=2E
The number of uploads is 4, downloads, 32=
=2E=2E=2E=2E it's totally ok to pick
a given fiber/cable/whatever test, =
but it does help to apply the same
characteristics to more of the tests =
you do, if you are trying to
compare technologies=2E
I'd be happy to test with a different set of speed test settings=2E Would =
Corporate/Edu be a better choice?

In going through this exercise= , I can imagine someone saying "where'd
all the bandwidth I paid for go= ?" as we trade bandwidth for reduced
latency=2E How do you sell that to= end users? ISPs have trained people to
think only in terms of raw spee= d (obviously that's best for an ISP's
bottom line as they can upsell yo= u the higher-priced package) and most
people (outside of gamers) don't = really grasp latency with the
intuitiveness of speed=2E Maybe we need s= ome Youtube videos showing end
user experiences of the benefit of reduc= ed latency=2E
Bloat mailing list
Bloat@lists=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet
<= a href=3D"https://lists=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet/listinfo/bloat">https://lists= =2Ebufferbloat=2Enet/listinfo/bloat

-- =
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail=2E Please excuse my brevity= =2E ------5C8R290X5PZ48KNL1P8H7LP9YK8OJJ--