From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from uplift.swm.pp.se (ipv6.swm.pp.se [IPv6:2a00:801::f]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0D980201ACC for ; Thu, 2 May 2013 21:50:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: by uplift.swm.pp.se (Postfix, from userid 501) id 813379E; Fri, 3 May 2013 06:50:30 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by uplift.swm.pp.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7950A9A; Fri, 3 May 2013 06:50:30 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 3 May 2013 06:50:30 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikael Abrahamsson To: Michael Richardson In-Reply-To: <4766.1367502675@sandelman.ca> Message-ID: References: <4766.1367502675@sandelman.ca> User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (DEB 1167 2008-08-23) Organization: People's Front Against WWW MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Cc: bloat Subject: Re: [Bloat] The bigger picture: whats components are used together to fight bloat X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 May 2013 04:50:34 -0000 On Thu, 2 May 2013, Michael Richardson wrote: > I anticipate similar problems trying to provide VoIP over (initially: > stationary) 3G. Two providers have promised me that I'll be able to do > PPP directly to the devices, but when they show me a price list, it's > clearly for whole(re)sale. I think the sales people don't understand > that they are lying, so I have less details on this. Even if you do ppp to the device, you're still not the bottleneck. Every 3G pluggable device I'm aware of does its own scheduling and just emulates/spoofs the ethernet/ppp layer so it's easier to integrate into the operating system. I wouldn't be surprised if most phones were done the same way, the OS of the system talks to the baseband part, but the baseband part does its own queueing. > So the problem is that we can't always know what amount to shape things > with. As I am working with a vendor of CPE and access devices which > says that they have an SDK, I attempting to put together a project to do > measurements. I will control the layer-3 devices at each end of the PPP(oE) > link... If you want to be able to do sane scheduling on 3GPP devices then you need to interact with the APIs provided to do traffic prioritization the 3GPP way. These are called "Traffic Flow Templates", but they basically just sorts packets according to criteria into different parallell queues (bearers) with different priority in the radio network. So you get a few FIFOs instead of just one. -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se