From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from uplift.swm.pp.se (swm.pp.se [212.247.200.143]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2CDBC21F21F for ; Mon, 9 Mar 2015 01:29:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: by uplift.swm.pp.se (Postfix, from userid 501) id 387FDA7; Mon, 9 Mar 2015 09:29:53 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=swm.pp.se; s=mail; t=1425889793; bh=QPobxRbjbY92bHqTGYZfSZh45XAxJa3QRJPEXrU13nY=; h=Date:From:To:cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=gg4vS1oFt1sc7c1DHl+nEmfrUUQKvmci1yjCbmN8WQugKVfllX4zC7efmct/K5psw pZD7hOZiUtb6kq7gshZWumJ+7W+F2V+DkUj4XylH+pqu1piO9H+kOlW1MsOf/RK/GH iIblhnzbE9BsKOpMJxz7ZqYUS8EUQh7tTmRPuYas= Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by uplift.swm.pp.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F513A6; Mon, 9 Mar 2015 09:29:53 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 09:29:53 +0100 (CET) From: Mikael Abrahamsson To: Koen Holtman In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: User-Agent: Alpine 2.02 (DEB 1266 2009-07-14) Organization: People's Front Against WWW MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net Subject: Re: [Bloat] [Bulk] Re: Motivating commercial entities? tell the sales manager (fwd) X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2015 08:30:25 -0000 On Sun, 8 Mar 2015, Koen Holtman wrote: > One thing that I am unclear on is whether the codel algorithms are mature > enough to allow them to be pitched as a low-risk solution that Wi-Fi vendors > could all adopt to fix bufferbloat. If I browse around I am getting a There are two things that the wifi vendors need to do, one is related to bufferbloat, the other is not. They need to make sure the drivers for their devices give enough support for the IP stack of the device to be able to handle bufferbloat. They need to make sure multicast works much better than it does today. IPv6 relies on it. If they can't fix this, then more people are going to rely on their cabled connections because wifi won't be good enough, and I would imagine this will make it less of a driver to upgrade their equipment to support newer Wifi standards, which sounds like that would hurt sales. If they do fix it, then whatever new standard they come up with will drive sales because now Wifi will work better and there would be a driver to upgrade for the userbase, for instance that they can watch multicast TV on their wifi (which plain doesn't work today). -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se