From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from nm10-vm6.access.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (nm10-vm6.access.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [216.39.63.158]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6FFD53B260 for ; Mon, 28 Nov 2016 07:48:58 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=rogers.com; s=s2048; t=1480337337; bh=2qKa81U+aeNYiLPuMexD8MRVUYhnOnM569vLgaxz1cI=; h=Reply-To:Subject:References:To:From:Date:In-Reply-To:From:Subject; b=HRvWZ7xlHfoYalXXhoV05UDyV7rJEpwbhMMOlGhFNHYuGV5MnEqot5bA8e4/hvH4hqIaHEvpVFH+Qp53TY1pxTHaiw08Mm0CSqRJ5PzgOkNoQ3Y1sktg+7zwyAJNLQkVxs3P4ZjuP48A4sZOr0deqrw4aAhk0xGyB3B1vUGkezg1XbhfzSPCQhmazN1nztCfESky9O00midRXgkbjXr4g5wLzDgC0WUTSvagP4vW128ml0gv4o970eBxNOQGRWq5e6a1eT5Ol/FMWdbFNAvLtai+26OeWTB+8Ymi4FKh8vlat4QpnweOei+SNIS03Y0XD61mof4SUw1UioZnzjRVgw== Received: from [216.39.60.175] by nm10.access.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2016 12:48:57 -0000 Received: from [67.195.22.118] by tm11.access.bullet.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2016 12:48:57 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp113.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2016 12:48:57 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 630495.80088.bm@smtp113.sbc.mail.gq1.yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-YMail-OSG: xYcLQEcVM1mLuvBQzCMV1K7e_iNEVq7S4svxqBk3ThMWnZw bg6mn6SDZaCDHXHHjVAA9vXiX3EvKe3egZRgTniMlyrW5VIYNTP2I9u42k7D iiv77saEmczW38fw4beKpngwxWglIJsmcpzRa9Dubfi5pA63dzH9MhgEcKBC mqQ7X3mmO8lnJaBJb78SlsMhY0Ac0kthDSWwNegHPQyUAQAfiHVNibpORKIX ._H9ox8t7EU18xBxyda08ycmHtNMTW2kIwY12K628IYIUIGdrqu7wNMXWR5y WL_ej9hY_U77lD6ewtwWRFzXSF6E8nwAPJigxOU3nMIpGtmus5cOWfJeKGde JXytDZyaBDdc922BY1mOz_F86gcL7tOIWzGUO3541DSO9rZoFeV4os3ejiSr GFLX33swmFSHJFUOt3AqbD9d2R_cN.or4n0D5OyucHizi00Wu4ERQtC26rMD 6maw9CSay7rM7C4leAbo.b5gWuwfTpviAEx5t8C7erLXupLjWkdUMkD6Jfpo lQCxCnDkQevhp4eVGO1GnV1MhrZPL404kKTRNrxLLiCkIzXZYeMuHWT7h85. X2TknmDM_sFDqkLYniy3uWRtQ X-Yahoo-SMTP: sltvjZWswBCRD.ElTuB1l9j6s9wRYPpuyTNWOE5oEg-- Reply-To: davecb@spamcop.net References: <548F6875-8670-4784-8A4D-9D4E6F0F20BD@gmail.com> <65cde0ee-4cc8-22c8-5274-a4eafe9cf338@pollere.com> To: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net From: David Collier-Brown Message-ID: Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 07:48:56 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [Bloat] Fixing bufferbloat in 2017 X-BeenThere: bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: General list for discussing Bufferbloat List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 12:48:58 -0000 A short RFC with a clear summary would change the ground on which we stand. Include me in if you're planning one. --dave On 28/11/16 01:00 AM, Jan Ceuleers wrote: > On 28/11/16 03:16, Jim Gettys wrote: >> Ookla may have made themselves long term irrelevant by their recent >> behavior. When your customers start funding development of a >> replacement (as Comcast has), you know they aren't happy. >> >> So I don't sweat Ookla: helping out the Comcast test effort is probably >> the best way to get bufferbloat in front of everyone, and best yet, the >> code for the tests is out there. > I do hope you're right Jim, but I still worry that Ookla is heavily > entrenched in carriers' test labs. This position has, I believe, come > about not because of Ookla's expertise in network testing but rather > because of market pull (i.e. speedtest.net's huge popularity with > end-users). > > As long as both of these positions remain (i.e. Ookla's mind share of > end-users and their resulting market share in the labs of large > purchasers of CPE) their lack of interest in bufferbloat is going to > keep this topic off the agenda in a large part of the industry. > > Unless Ookla can be coerced somehow. > > I have previously suggested standardising network throughput testing > methods and "grading" criteria. If there's an RFC on this subject > carriers are going to be interested in conformance to it and will > pressure their suppliers (of network testing gear, of CPE etc). > _______________________________________________ > Bloat mailing list > Bloat@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/bloat -- David Collier-Brown, | Always do right. This will gratify System Programmer and Author | some people and astonish the rest davecb@spamcop.net | -- Mark Twain