From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Authentication-Results: mail.toke.dk; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=lang.hm; dkim=fail; arc=none (Message is not ARC signed); dmarc=none Received: from mail.lang.hm (wsip-70-167-213-146.ph.ph.cox.net [70.167.213.146]) by mail.toke.dk (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 57026111732B; Tue, 19 May 2026 20:59:46 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [10.2.3.133] (unknown [10.2.3.133]) by mail.lang.hm (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CF37225700; Tue, 19 May 2026 11:59:44 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 19 May 2026 11:59:39 -0700 (MST) From: David Lang To: "Livingood, Jason" cc: David Lang , "bob.mcmahon@umbernetworks.com" , Frantisek Borsik , Cake List , Make-Wifi-fast , bloat , Jeremy Austin via Rpm , "codel@lists.bufferbloat.net" , "Dave.seddon Ca" , William Fisher , Igor Aleinikov , Jim , Jiml , Douglas Fairbairn , Thomas , Tim Odriscoll , Morten , Sebastian Moeller , Mt Denicolo , Mmcmahon01 , Santanu Sinha , Matthew In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0oq1n88q-36qn-p6s7-699s-p4nr0440p950@ynat.uz> References: <709dac7800ee7ad92aafd4eab1c761d9@umbernetworks.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Message-ID-Hash: HJCYCYD4JBPTMVQJUB3FEC7PNQSXRYUO X-Message-ID-Hash: HJCYCYD4JBPTMVQJUB3FEC7PNQSXRYUO X-MailFrom: david@lang.hm X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; loop; banned-address; emergency; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.10 Precedence: list Subject: [Cake] Re: [Bloat] Re: "Fi-Wi is a new forwarding plane for wireless" - Bob McMahon List-Id: Cake - FQ_codel the next generation Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On Tue, 19 May 2026, Livingood, Jason wrote: >> You speak of fiber to the room, but that doesn't seem to be the trend that I >> see. I see less interest in connections to rooms (fiber or copper), with >> 'everyone will just use wifi', and reluctance to wire for the APs. > > In what country? The US? I think other countries are likely ahead of the US in > wiring. In any case, I agree everyone wants to just use wireless but the > in-home wireless environment is quite bad and is a key performance limiter for > very nearly every home in the US. ISTM that Bob is exploring one way of trying > to improve that. I do not believe it should be acceptable to us as > technologists that the home network is such an intractable performance > problem. ;-) many other countries have older houses than the US, I'd be amazed if they had newer wiring. (I could be wrong) the reason home wifi is so bad is because there is no coordination between the wifi in the diffeent houses/apartments. you don't need to tie all those devices into a single network to solve that, and unless you do solve the coordination problem, there is no way for you to make the rf environment better. coordination may only be an 80% solution compared to this, but 80% is a lot. David Lang