From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-lf0-x244.google.com (mail-lf0-x244.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c07::244]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F13743B2A4 for ; Mon, 1 May 2017 01:50:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-lf0-x244.google.com with SMTP id 75so12440378lfs.3 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2017 22:50:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=RlF1Gu9eGZRR7ZWBcU+yGfVXQd6Vh5m1wDWW7e/Esks=; b=VHcwjvSFhxnE10wfwrPqRhzSPUSv4h8NJXdGMPUBWXxBuV3WbdUR9ofxhLrk4g1M5Y bTy/6M2W71WRHPo24qwAzVDK4VG7JYYDUzfkL8HZmf/3j2D0J1Jtr7gKxjDqr7O6fQWs E0T4OJc9pZFieGQJA6RfbYUAqOj+grU5CgLEG/zmMjVMcTmU4P/9+zKQk4KN6rrKN7xV qP1BppJ/gHscEScmOREF9L2AL375N8zQIatE68chS+E7B0CV+ttf+EFV6/dDfaEcHDci jntFA34qDzwklCcV3c1tHG9adKZrI+PUSv7hhAvuMDdPZ9SrSp3YV/+uOyhtj3RCoUpl F04w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=RlF1Gu9eGZRR7ZWBcU+yGfVXQd6Vh5m1wDWW7e/Esks=; b=DlchCA/MbjQAJ3rEiBZHMcXTmsEbvaXcdAchJzpvgi8t6r18h40PdDai7sqC0A2Vw4 +J84wby8N4ItOvW5rdx2bC8Y0JdGr/5ZGtHZo1NhNJgGjMU7d5AWArpflyULcKP0KP1O pSTCK06cqz4n8iXZoIbPXz0iHLTJLI0KxdH7j56WfFvJ6vTMg4D7byg3xJ8k5Pn+OM4e 2yNwZs23xCabxSd56/11AnMjZuR/SdbqHlm89sqd2R2QQQi2H7rR4I7R5R7vGySvRb/x +Hbt7kN57WY9TY55pRLsHbtJZ67eH+A7uL7wRBxsTTFL4KqqEB8QEYonbMHoGPy20vU1 yHQQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AN3rC/4BoizVlDsuXkGUwLlS1nodt32IRsMR341VKYSyclggnlWahSxB sFLnQV8IEs7Xmw== X-Received: by 10.25.80.75 with SMTP id z11mr6848033lfj.78.1493617808687; Sun, 30 Apr 2017 22:50:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.100.12] (37-219-103-185.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi. [37.219.103.185]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g79sm2493679lfh.46.2017.04.30.22.50.06 (version=TLS1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 30 Apr 2017 22:50:07 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) From: Jonathan Morton In-Reply-To: <93a030eb-f96a-5751-89ef-99b1bbbb8fbd@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 1 May 2017 08:50:04 +0300 Cc: Dendari Marini , Benjamin Cronce , cake@lists.bufferbloat.net Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <00DDAA0B-7D99-489B-BA2D-1F20289409B3@gmx.de> <2FFBF256-2932-4FC7-AD1F-0D7CEE111809@gmx.de> <3fbfd0ee-7b41-0f83-8b44-ce7eed6a0562@gmail.com> <09DB0D8E-F63C-4126-8608-9EACDE99D2F1@gmail.com> <64b0e940-84ae-e75c-0ddb-10e60452c59a@gmail.com> <3FA974FA-E306-42FC-9CBD-0F5B5F8CABED@gmail.com> <93a030eb-f96a-5751-89ef-99b1bbbb8fbd@gmail.com> To: Andy Furniss X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) Subject: Re: [Cake] Getting Cake to work better with Steam and similar applications X-BeenThere: cake@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Cake - FQ_codel the next generation List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 May 2017 05:50:10 -0000 > I am guessing that the ingress param just shouldn't be used when it's > not (as you said) a large fraction of the bottleneck. That might be a reasonable conclusion, actually. Here the governing = bottleneck is clearly Cake=E2=80=99s shaper as configured, not the = physical link. > I suspect that with low bandwidth + many drops + pretending the drops > were sent, that the whole queue goes over rate, rather than just the > individual flows. Yes, at present only the overall shaper gets the special accounting. In = principle it might also be valid to modify the DRR++ system similarly, = so that the fairness metric is also applied to the physical link being = controlled, rather than to the delivery rate. But as long as the difference between the physical link rate and the = shaped rate is reasonably small, it works well enough for now. - Jonathan Morton