From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-oa1-x31.google.com (mail-oa1-x31.google.com [IPv6:2001:4860:4864:20::31]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4F6C63B29E for ; Fri, 10 Jan 2025 12:08:00 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail-oa1-x31.google.com with SMTP id 586e51a60fabf-29e5aedbebdso1094884fac.0 for ; Fri, 10 Jan 2025 09:08:00 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1736528879; x=1737133679; darn=lists.bufferbloat.net; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=cXudahsqak2ImclcJcQlhQxs28vWFr4vdxQi1c8Ob3s=; b=jikaaduoLPtcSUgMrTaMa+u4r6Dsil/recdiHLKCwD1E24SP0dEFe1Y4eAbvKipdb6 AiVVccIHbUWdrKTmmSvFj9T2V0N6RA+UKyq04z9XdC2K0z+64Y1NZ1xH0n+Y3p5ivBxc yVGIzcOoYAepNIWoG6gEAY6HHVcPjxLL7hbcaJxJrcH/vzkZcnHSxseJ9nQXqkn+t3ES ESHmDU/BKfwtAfSexYFlZcZX7YjBQCmh/Cd/2a8YKGaKq86ZrhTaSedtuz1yIM1QTRXG 7TTZ00Iaoep0jT0rObMiSTWFhDg44c47lHGA7lIX4f/upqjHWz7e8dXZ8Qx6CiYSe/Ku d1nA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1736528879; x=1737133679; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=cXudahsqak2ImclcJcQlhQxs28vWFr4vdxQi1c8Ob3s=; b=lYTPAHRGiWnXapu5k2cF4whozDQ0XyoYA6qpd2F/nE/dDyQ3WombAUk5+sWTCNtzeQ k9RUkwKotoOzwAOESUVdNd2W4kVxisyxddLZEtMlwmWhn642MqtNGaEZwLBxJomiQQaB Q4qIb2/4jCdbI3l/ESN0yO6x/JQpF7tZEKiEwPVgOcCTXEKMGYKEB1nGJZowtnAwh/KS qq2D6xCfe8j+3/Z8unsjXXfNc4KsqdXGe1ecOMryirAlLUU9pEuLw+MGlb94Zv1+WEx2 DhjCT5dttFtSJn0Pti7FwwznYMHh3WRVnE9XT0yedQR98QMOXUCLFMulKI1v6QI+8FSZ 1g6g== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCWxdumqWxse2FDnrsmAgBuXuWJr5AknUxBeTviNHC729Sb+KGTH5jMQwPoMBfTDEihBazsv@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YxcLolcenbVn3IHSANGpmozjT2hSaGt8lw7I1dXBGgbFDrGacu6 46KByeZf6Q+sMN1+INg43m+yzJ3Wy9W/B+XiB3tKZf9F4i5lTI6EWobObdhZ0m29yp3gyaixgCv sbm+vrWCtAWSDamdSnGGtUaaVNwE= X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncuIQ6AXojhvPede9LAJBUmfO+sRNQVhg49nTh1hqAW59cayXH5fc7kIuypRPow 3RLaL4j1F1/weOSOjqzi7GC7XECnTlIxkE80= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFJrz5TJi8kZegbXRcUYdLD4YwfVouGmrPPQHLK4OESwq8XLadNrOn5Z01HtTEHssCqR3Zu9KTnpkAW13anj54= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6870:9c83:b0:28c:8476:dd76 with SMTP id 586e51a60fabf-2aa0690e62amr6777948fac.29.1736528879417; Fri, 10 Jan 2025 09:07:59 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20250110155531.300303-1-toke@redhat.com> <2FE6B2E2-9A34-47C1-B203-F0C424F00704@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: From: Dave Taht Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2025 09:07:46 -0800 X-Gm-Features: AbW1kvZYX9_xVKZxAfRozxClUZjANiF-ESQ2wxX8_D9MdSHyRnx3vqxwS2aX9dU Message-ID: To: Sebastian Moeller Cc: =?UTF-8?B?VG9rZSBIw7hpbGFuZC1Kw7hyZ2Vuc2Vu?= , =?UTF-8?B?VG9rZSBIw7hpbGFuZC1Kw7hyZ2Vuc2Vu?= , cake@lists.bufferbloat.net Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="000000000000001bba062b5d2319" Subject: Re: [Cake] [PATCH net-next] sched: sch_cake: Align QoS treatment to Windows and Zoom X-BeenThere: cake@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Cake - FQ_codel the next generation List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2025 17:08:00 -0000 --000000000000001bba062b5d2319 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Jan 10, 2025 at 9:02=E2=80=AFAM Sebastian Moeller = wrote: > > > > On 10 January 2025 17:34:45 CET, Dave Taht wrote: > >actually in re-reading that, I think it leaves nqb in 0 (44, not 45, > >is now VI), which wasn't my intent. > > > >More below... > > > >On Fri, Jan 10, 2025 at 8:24=E2=80=AFAM Sebastian Moeller wrote: > >> > >> Mmmh. off the Linux lists/folks for discussion: > >> > >> can I propose to drop NQB down to BestEffort? The supposed requirement= s for NQB marking should make these flows thrive in a flow isolating schedu= ler like cake without any special treatment... moving it to Video or worse = Voice really only invites abuse... > > > >I would prefer consistent behavior. > > Without proper policing, NQB in Voice, with all/most other traffic in Bes= tEffort a single NQB flow can easily hog up to 50% (I believe this is the c= ake default) of capacity... > first rule of priority schedulers think twice before exposing a priority = scheduler without admission control to the wider internet... I do not think NQB belongs in Voice (which shares priority with netcontrol, etc). I also do not think it belongs in best effort as the intent is to get a quick response to a short flow. yes, FQ solves a lot of problems, but At some point you have to trust the intent.. > > > > >> > >> > >> > >> > On 10. Jan 2025, at 16:55, Toke H=C3=B8iland-J=C3=B8rgensen via Cake= wrote: > >> > > >> > From: Dave Taht > >> > > >> > Cake's diffserv4 mode attempted to follow the IETF webrtc > >> > QoS marking standards, RFC8837. > >> > > >> > It turns out Windows QoS can only use CS0, CS1, CS5, and CS7. > >> > >> Nah, applications apparently can only request a small set of DSCPs, bu= t it is possible to make whole applications use a different DSCP: > >> example for making putty use EF > >> > >> New-NetQosPolicy -Name "putty" -AppPathNameMatchCondition "putty.exe" = -PolicyStore ActiveStore -NetworkProfile All -DSCPAction 46 > > > >Within an App... > > Yepp, that solves zoom's issue, as I am willing to bet default all CS0 zo= om does not have fluidity issues due to congesting itself... > > > > >> > >> > >> > > >> > Zoom defaults to using CS5 for video and screen sharing traffic. > >> > >> Zoom defaults to using CS0 (my packet captures) unless an adminstrator= enables DSCPs, which I assume will only/mostly happen for business account= s. > > > >I have seen it enabled. > > Sure, on business accounts that do come with an administrator access to t= he businesses zoom account... typical home users are CS0 all the way, all t= he time. > > > I have also multiple reports of "stuttering", > >which I am hoping this resolves. > > > >> > >> > Bump CS4, CS5, and NQB to the video tin (2) in diffserv4 mode, for > >> > more bandwidth and lower priority. > >> > >> I do endorse that, but that change will affect all current users of ca= ke as parts of their individual QoS hierarchies. > > > >I think windows users are not as clued. > > They are also not that likely to use cake in the first place... so for th= e convenience on users we do not have we risk annoying experienced users. I= am not saying this should stop us but we should consider that, after all t= his can not easily be overridden via the commandline. > > >> > > >> > This also better aligns with how WiFi presently treats CS5 and NQB. > >> > >> Two issues: it is not that default WiFi uses a sane system to begin wi= th, and NQB IMHO should not be elevated in priority unless it is also polic= ed well, something neither WiFi nor cake will do out of the box. > >> > >> > >> > > >> > Signed-off-by: Dave Taht > >> > Signed-off-by: Toke H=C3=B8iland-J=C3=B8rgensen > >> > --- > >> > net/sched/sch_cake.c | 4 ++-- > >> > 1 file changed, 2 insertions(+), 2 deletions(-) > >> > > >> > diff --git a/net/sched/sch_cake.c b/net/sched/sch_cake.c > >> > index 48dd8c88903f..2a9288d4b873 100644 > >> > --- a/net/sched/sch_cake.c > >> > +++ b/net/sched/sch_cake.c > >> > @@ -328,8 +328,8 @@ static const u8 diffserv4[] =3D { > >> > 1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, > >> > 2, 0, 2, 0, 2, 0, 2, 0, > >> > 2, 0, 2, 0, 2, 0, 2, 0, > >> > - 3, 0, 2, 0, 2, 0, 2, 0, > >> > - 3, 0, 0, 0, 3, 0, 3, 0, > >> > + 2, 0, 2, 0, 2, 0, 2, 0, > >> > + 2, 0, 0, 0, 2, 0, 3, 0, > >> > 3, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, > >> > 3, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, > >> > }; > >> > -- > >> > 2.47.1 > >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > Cake mailing list > >> > Cake@lists.bufferbloat.net > >> > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/cake > >> > > > > > > -- > Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. 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