[Cake] CAKE is going to be deployed on Alta Labs any day now!

[Cake] CAKE is going to be deployed on Alta Labs any day now!

[Frantisek Borsik]

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Should be pushed through production in day or two and they will be talking
about it on https://streamyard.com/watch/ubYm2AffWkYi this
Wednesday,  March 19, at 1PM EST / 12PM CST / 11AM MST / 10AM PST

Can't wait.

All the best,

Frank

Frantisek (Frank) Borsik



https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik

Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714

iMessage, mobile: +420775230885

Skype: casioa5302ca

frantisek.borsik@gmail.com

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Re: [Cake] CAKE is going to be deployed on Alta Labs any day now!

[jordan]

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Looks like you were right on, Frank.

 

Route10 Firmware 1.4d Released! - Routers - Alta Labs <https://forum.alta.inc/t/route10-firmware-1-4d-released/4893> 

 

Jordan

 

From: Cake <cake-bounces@lists.bufferbloat.net> On Behalf Of Frantisek Borsik via Cake
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2025 6:01 PM
To: Cake List <cake@lists.bufferbloat.net>
Subject: [Cake] CAKE is going to be deployed on Alta Labs any day now!

 

Should be pushed through production in day or two and they will be talking about it on https://streamyard.com/watch/ubYm2AffWkYi this Wednesday,  March 19, at 1PM EST / 12PM CST / 11AM MST / 10AM PST

 

Can't wait.

 

All the best,

 

Frank

Frantisek (Frank) Borsik

 

 <https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik> https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik

Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714 

iMessage, mobile: +420775230885

Skype: casioa5302ca

 <mailto:frantisek.borsik@gmail.com> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com


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Re: [Cake] CAKE is going to be deployed on Alta Labs any day now!

[Jonathan Morton]

> On 19 Mar, 2025, at 12:01 am, Frantisek Borsik via Cake <cake@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
> 
> Should be pushed through production in day or two and they will be talking about it on https://streamyard.com/watch/ubYm2AffWkYi this Wednesday,  March 19, at 1PM EST / 12PM CST / 11AM MST / 10AM PST

I joined the stream, and was able to ask about the throughput they were getting with CAKE on their hardware.  This is just for the "Route 10" rather than their APs, and they reported getting about 2.5Gbps throughput with CAKE enabled. They do correctly note that the hardware-accelerated forwarding path is disabled for the interface where CAKE is turned on.

Supporting 2.5Gbps is pretty good I think, and should be sufficient to handle all practical Internet subscriptions that are likely to require bufferbloat mitigation.  For comparison, on the same call they claimed about 800Mbps throughput for acting as a WireGuard tunnel endpoint.

 - Jonathan Morton

Re: [Cake] CAKE is going to be deployed on Alta Labs any day now!

[Frantisek Borsik]

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Happy to see that! Thanks, guys.

Adding Jeff <https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeff-hansen-6794021/>, Alta Labs
CTO - Darryl <https://x.com/DaryllSwer/status/1902486684476047544> has a
suggestion how to push this further: "Maybe they can add both FQ_CoDel and
CAKE with BQL support? How's hardware-offloading of FQ_CoDel looking on
these “prosumer” equipment these days? I haven't kept up over a year on
this topic."

All the best,

Frank

Frantisek (Frank) Borsik



https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik

Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714

iMessage, mobile: +420775230885

Skype: casioa5302ca

frantisek.borsik@gmail.com


On Fri, Mar 21, 2025 at 3:44 AM Jonathan Morton <chromatix99@gmail.com>
wrote:

> > On 19 Mar, 2025, at 12:01 am, Frantisek Borsik via Cake <
> cake@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
> >
> > Should be pushed through production in day or two and they will be
> talking about it on https://streamyard.com/watch/ubYm2AffWkYi this
> Wednesday,  March 19, at 1PM EST / 12PM CST / 11AM MST / 10AM PST
>
> I joined the stream, and was able to ask about the throughput they were
> getting with CAKE on their hardware.  This is just for the "Route 10"
> rather than their APs, and they reported getting about 2.5Gbps throughput
> with CAKE enabled. They do correctly note that the hardware-accelerated
> forwarding path is disabled for the interface where CAKE is turned on.
>
> Supporting 2.5Gbps is pretty good I think, and should be sufficient to
> handle all practical Internet subscriptions that are likely to require
> bufferbloat mitigation.  For comparison, on the same call they claimed
> about 800Mbps throughput for acting as a WireGuard tunnel endpoint.
>
>  - Jonathan Morton

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Re: [Cake] CAKE is going to be deployed on Alta Labs any day now!

[Jeff Hansen]

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Frank,

The hardware that Route10 is based off of doesn’t support FQ Codel nor CAKE at all, so everything is done in software on our 5.4 Linux kernel. It works great, though. In some instances it’s the only way to max out a PPPoE connection and have optimal latency.

It doesn’t look like our ethernet driver supports BQL at all, so we haven’t tried that yet, but as is, it absolutely eliminates high latency if tuned properly.

-Jeff

> On Mar 21, 2025, at 2:27 AM, Frantisek Borsik <frantisek.borsik@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Happy to see that! Thanks, guys.
> 
> Adding Jeff <https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeff-hansen-6794021/>, Alta Labs CTO - Darryl <https://x.com/DaryllSwer/status/1902486684476047544> has a suggestion how to push this further: "Maybe they can add both FQ_CoDel and CAKE with BQL support? How's hardware-offloading of FQ_CoDel looking on these “prosumer” equipment these days? I haven't kept up over a year on this topic."
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Frank
> 
> Frantisek (Frank) Borsik
> 
>  
> 
> https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
> 
> Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714 
> 
> iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
> 
> Skype: casioa5302ca
> 
> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com <mailto:frantisek.borsik@gmail.com>
> 
> On Fri, Mar 21, 2025 at 3:44 AM Jonathan Morton <chromatix99@gmail.com <mailto:chromatix99@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> > On 19 Mar, 2025, at 12:01 am, Frantisek Borsik via Cake <cake@lists.bufferbloat.net <mailto:cake@lists.bufferbloat.net>> wrote:
>> > 
>> > Should be pushed through production in day or two and they will be talking about it on https://streamyard.com/watch/ubYm2AffWkYi this Wednesday,  March 19, at 1PM EST / 12PM CST / 11AM MST / 10AM PST
>> 
>> I joined the stream, and was able to ask about the throughput they were getting with CAKE on their hardware.  This is just for the "Route 10" rather than their APs, and they reported getting about 2.5Gbps throughput with CAKE enabled. They do correctly note that the hardware-accelerated forwarding path is disabled for the interface where CAKE is turned on.
>> 
>> Supporting 2.5Gbps is pretty good I think, and should be sufficient to handle all practical Internet subscriptions that are likely to require bufferbloat mitigation.  For comparison, on the same call they claimed about 800Mbps throughput for acting as a WireGuard tunnel endpoint.
>> 
>>  - Jonathan Morton


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Re: [Cake] CAKE is going to be deployed on Alta Labs any day now!

[Daryll Swer]

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I was looking at your Route10 product, but it looks to be consumer-heavy,
at this point time. I run stuff like BGP in my home network (as I have
MPLS-to-the-home delivery) and PIM-SM, would be cool if you folks supported
some DC-fabric features on Route10 in the future with FRR as the daemon or
something.

One thing I'd like to mention, Route10 should have a good NAT
implementation to support EIM-NAT for TCP/UDP to allow P2P networking to
work over a NAT box.
Additionally, support NAT Hairpinning for user's LAN subnets to allow
intra-NAT traffic to work over STUN discovery, this eliminates TURN traffic.
Small to large-scale CGNAT deployments around the globe is something I've
been consulting for a few years now. I'm happy to potentially beta test
your products, if you'd like, for best practices conformance with very
specific RFCs.

BQL would be good to have for long-term viewpoint, perhaps your Ethernet
driver provider, could patch it up for BQL support and that would be a good
foundation for FQ_Codel on your Route10. MikroTik has FQ_Codel, but lacks
BQL, and they refused to listen to Fran and Dave Taht, so perhaps you folks
are our only hope :)

*--*
Best Regards
Daryll Swer
Website: daryllswer.com
<https://mailtrack.io/l/6bdc1188688bc319302e68dd0abb6ef092a85bc8?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.daryllswer.com&u=2153471&signature=673d0c5350bbb0e6>


On Mon, 24 Mar 2025 at 20:53, Jeff Hansen <x@jeffhansen.com> wrote:

> Frank,
>
> The hardware that Route10 is based off of doesn’t support FQ Codel nor
> CAKE at all, so everything is done in software on our 5.4 Linux kernel. It
> works great, though. In some instances it’s the only way to max out a PPPoE
> connection and have optimal latency.
>
> It doesn’t look like our ethernet driver supports BQL at all, so we
> haven’t tried that yet, but as is, it absolutely eliminates high latency if
> tuned properly.
>
> -Jeff
>
> On Mar 21, 2025, at 2:27 AM, Frantisek Borsik <frantisek.borsik@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Happy to see that! Thanks, guys.
>
> Adding Jeff
> <https://mailtrack.io/l/874104aa2fae8c2c3e8c0b7c66386cd9ef1a83ab?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.linkedin.com%2Fin%2Fjeff-hansen-6794021%2F&u=2153471&signature=efe63bcd8a19e5e7>,
> Alta Labs CTO - Darryl
> <https://mailtrack.io/l/56dc9d27cea2a0afbd536db4021116428c91b0e6?url=https%3A%2F%2Fx.com%2FDaryllSwer%2Fstatus%2F1902486684476047544&u=2153471&signature=b49f25a96708f53a>
> has a suggestion how to push this further: "Maybe they can add both
> FQ_CoDel and CAKE with BQL support? How's hardware-offloading of FQ_CoDel
> looking on these “prosumer” equipment these days? I haven't kept up over a
> year on this topic."
>
> All the best,
>
> Frank
>
> Frantisek (Frank) Borsik
>
>
>
> https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
> <https://mailtrack.io/l/62c56dba3ad2b34d25f6a2db81adf0b5e9e7c6aa?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.linkedin.com%2Fin%2Ffrantisekborsik&u=2153471&signature=80914c9fb3689eb2>
>
> Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714
>
> iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
>
> Skype: casioa5302ca
>
> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 21, 2025 at 3:44 AM Jonathan Morton <chromatix99@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> > On 19 Mar, 2025, at 12:01 am, Frantisek Borsik via Cake <
>> cake@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>> >
>> > Should be pushed through production in day or two and they will be
>> talking about it on https://streamyard.com/watch/ubYm2AffWkYi
>> <https://mailtrack.io/l/f6be4a2c3da3f8d78695f24266cda26e686e9453?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstreamyard.com%2Fwatch%2FubYm2AffWkYi&u=2153471&signature=a5dbc7add3e2dbe3>
>> this Wednesday,  March 19, at 1PM EST / 12PM CST / 11AM MST / 10AM PST
>>
>> I joined the stream, and was able to ask about the throughput they were
>> getting with CAKE on their hardware.  This is just for the "Route 10"
>> rather than their APs, and they reported getting about 2.5Gbps throughput
>> with CAKE enabled. They do correctly note that the hardware-accelerated
>> forwarding path is disabled for the interface where CAKE is turned on.
>>
>> Supporting 2.5Gbps is pretty good I think, and should be sufficient to
>> handle all practical Internet subscriptions that are likely to require
>> bufferbloat mitigation.  For comparison, on the same call they claimed
>> about 800Mbps throughput for acting as a WireGuard tunnel endpoint.
>>
>>  - Jonathan Morton
>
>
>

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Re: [Cake] CAKE is going to be deployed on Alta Labs any day now!

[Frantisek Borsik]

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Alta Labs just published a video explaining their CAKE implementation:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxDO0flKcI0

All the best,

Frank

Frantisek (Frank) Borsik



https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik

Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714

iMessage, mobile: +420775230885

Skype: casioa5302ca

frantisek.borsik@gmail.com


On Mon, Mar 24, 2025 at 4:39 PM Daryll Swer <contact@daryllswer.com> wrote:

> I was looking at your Route10 product, but it looks to be consumer-heavy,
> at this point time. I run stuff like BGP in my home network (as I have
> MPLS-to-the-home delivery) and PIM-SM, would be cool if you folks supported
> some DC-fabric features on Route10 in the future with FRR as the daemon or
> something.
>
> One thing I'd like to mention, Route10 should have a good NAT
> implementation to support EIM-NAT for TCP/UDP to allow P2P networking to
> work over a NAT box.
> Additionally, support NAT Hairpinning for user's LAN subnets to allow
> intra-NAT traffic to work over STUN discovery, this eliminates TURN traffic.
> Small to large-scale CGNAT deployments around the globe is something I've
> been consulting for a few years now. I'm happy to potentially beta test
> your products, if you'd like, for best practices conformance with very
> specific RFCs.
>
> BQL would be good to have for long-term viewpoint, perhaps your Ethernet
> driver provider, could patch it up for BQL support and that would be a good
> foundation for FQ_Codel on your Route10. MikroTik has FQ_Codel, but lacks
> BQL, and they refused to listen to Fran and Dave Taht, so perhaps you folks
> are our only hope :)
>
> *--*
> Best Regards
> Daryll Swer
> Website: daryllswer.com
> <https://mailtrack.io/l/6bdc1188688bc319302e68dd0abb6ef092a85bc8?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.daryllswer.com&u=2153471&signature=673d0c5350bbb0e6>
>
>
> On Mon, 24 Mar 2025 at 20:53, Jeff Hansen <x@jeffhansen.com> wrote:
>
>> Frank,
>>
>> The hardware that Route10 is based off of doesn’t support FQ Codel nor
>> CAKE at all, so everything is done in software on our 5.4 Linux kernel. It
>> works great, though. In some instances it’s the only way to max out a PPPoE
>> connection and have optimal latency.
>>
>> It doesn’t look like our ethernet driver supports BQL at all, so we
>> haven’t tried that yet, but as is, it absolutely eliminates high latency if
>> tuned properly.
>>
>> -Jeff
>>
>> On Mar 21, 2025, at 2:27 AM, Frantisek Borsik <frantisek.borsik@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Happy to see that! Thanks, guys.
>>
>> Adding Jeff
>> <https://mailtrack.io/l/874104aa2fae8c2c3e8c0b7c66386cd9ef1a83ab?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.linkedin.com%2Fin%2Fjeff-hansen-6794021%2F&u=2153471&signature=efe63bcd8a19e5e7>,
>> Alta Labs CTO - Darryl
>> <https://mailtrack.io/l/56dc9d27cea2a0afbd536db4021116428c91b0e6?url=https%3A%2F%2Fx.com%2FDaryllSwer%2Fstatus%2F1902486684476047544&u=2153471&signature=b49f25a96708f53a>
>> has a suggestion how to push this further: "Maybe they can add both
>> FQ_CoDel and CAKE with BQL support? How's hardware-offloading of FQ_CoDel
>> looking on these “prosumer” equipment these days? I haven't kept up over a
>> year on this topic."
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>> Frank
>>
>> Frantisek (Frank) Borsik
>>
>>
>>
>> https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
>> <https://mailtrack.io/l/62c56dba3ad2b34d25f6a2db81adf0b5e9e7c6aa?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.linkedin.com%2Fin%2Ffrantisekborsik&u=2153471&signature=80914c9fb3689eb2>
>>
>> Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714
>>
>> iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
>>
>> Skype: casioa5302ca
>>
>> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 21, 2025 at 3:44 AM Jonathan Morton <chromatix99@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> > On 19 Mar, 2025, at 12:01 am, Frantisek Borsik via Cake <
>>> cake@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > Should be pushed through production in day or two and they will be
>>> talking about it on https://streamyard.com/watch/ubYm2AffWkYi
>>> <https://mailtrack.io/l/f6be4a2c3da3f8d78695f24266cda26e686e9453?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstreamyard.com%2Fwatch%2FubYm2AffWkYi&u=2153471&signature=a5dbc7add3e2dbe3>
>>> this Wednesday,  March 19, at 1PM EST / 12PM CST / 11AM MST / 10AM PST
>>>
>>> I joined the stream, and was able to ask about the throughput they were
>>> getting with CAKE on their hardware.  This is just for the "Route 10"
>>> rather than their APs, and they reported getting about 2.5Gbps throughput
>>> with CAKE enabled. They do correctly note that the hardware-accelerated
>>> forwarding path is disabled for the interface where CAKE is turned on.
>>>
>>> Supporting 2.5Gbps is pretty good I think, and should be sufficient to
>>> handle all practical Internet subscriptions that are likely to require
>>> bufferbloat mitigation.  For comparison, on the same call they claimed
>>> about 800Mbps throughput for acting as a WireGuard tunnel endpoint.
>>>
>>>  - Jonathan Morton
>>
>>
>>

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