From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-lf0-x22a.google.com (mail-lf0-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c07::22a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C30C43B2A4 for ; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 12:44:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-lf0-x22a.google.com with SMTP id z130-v6so9213853lff.5 for ; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 09:44:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=/9PwlxU7IkpLulVTKNBbM36XqcCcL3vRImcC1yvAzgc=; b=NAckSYI/k94j0zmjLGwCd/yjx2+uGzDs/uLCfXmpYCEjxaTh0bAW56jPTllENn31B8 +TpA0huaK78dGTNurbiNBqCJwx+RDtmLa2G4XRoYFUvfDZy/B/AF8uzn1mFNMCaOHRdu WMnbvV+VAcSgUm4FLeWK43AMqm/7u1e/qOUpsKwHOZyM2+QRKw5LspS69yBqeSytPzwt cTM/dyBwoI6U6QqamcS1ZFQBrBG9q0HKQ63fWrb2fPPqzZooOM08oy4Ph5n2sikacFvi QHWzaJOecYMTRwXUtFhn+gOM6eaO58BVI4Vja4ZZPZYPOUrjitVo2MlLDQM08Ay4VLI9 sBRg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=/9PwlxU7IkpLulVTKNBbM36XqcCcL3vRImcC1yvAzgc=; b=YQLSppCzkOpg3/5iso3vsnT3H0nak2hY8MfXYn09C2Kok4B0JkF3232mxGUZW/Uf/k SBts4oMBXPwHvnWpjGD21piUtFG8tbEnDSY22qGK0p2Q/aTr0sSkUM1InK03CC5U8jSN fb5hw0XCPQFy+uuOU+bBgcF5D+2Xu2/hKPVjNbd4vzU5k7Jt7SgZQmQ4XFGQhhHbazsG MzE3upT9vWwt5gopYdtWT/4yigL+IsSwrS/IVoQ6idWu4tf9UmtqJ2IcqCIN2mRWrnOU 1coR0Nd/Oxtsy0GaiMdUgMH2knCIQCU05FMZJDUA5DTZB3aldkr0wGhVRfB8PvPrYFqx uXDg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tBUUbXvJQCRS47ey3GIpghgYHdo01EHSQBD4rNpmQccbk1dv9ZK b61Pf7mYCusY58Nt89NkU7M= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AB8JxZr18tz9Cp/4Uh7Bw1Yinsx34nX/2hvZbAyIR9XZBEEEckAHYBFb4ojWgqimPk+kAOseXp2tEg== X-Received: by 2002:a19:93ce:: with SMTP id w75-v6mr5446424lfk.38.1524329055286; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 09:44:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.239.216] (83-245-234-255-nat-p.elisa-mobile.fi. [83.245.234.255]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id v64sm1546262lje.56.2018.04.21.09.44.14 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 21 Apr 2018 09:44:14 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.3 \(3445.6.18\)) From: Jonathan Morton In-Reply-To: Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 19:44:12 +0300 Cc: =?utf-8?Q?Toke_H=C3=B8iland-J=C3=B8rgensen?= , cake@lists.bufferbloat.net Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <87k1t38d2q.fsf@toke.dk> To: Pete Heist X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.6.18) Subject: Re: [Cake] Diffserv LLT mode X-BeenThere: cake@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Cake - FQ_codel the next generation List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 16:44:17 -0000 >> Is anyone actually using the LLT diffserv setting? >=20 > I re-tested diffserv-llt quickly using the current head of cake and = tc-adv and am confused by something: >=20 > = http://drhleny.cz/bufferbloat/cake/round5/diffserv_rrul_eg_cake_ds-llt_50m= bit/index.html >=20 > When I look at the qdisc stats for cake, there are 5 tins: Low Loss, = Best Effort, Low Delay, Bulk and Net Control. Shouldn=E2=80=99t the Low = Delay tin have its target and interval reduced to something below 5ms = and 100ms? And the bulk tin has a target and interval of 5.8ms and = 100.8ms(?) >=20 > In short, I forget how diffserv-llt was supposed to work, regardless = of whether or not it=E2=80=99s on the chopping block. No need for a = history lesson if it will be removed=E2=80=A6 :) >=20 > Improved intra-flow latency could be useful for HTTP/2 or other = things, but I don=E2=80=99t see how the current llt mode helps most = ordinary people with that, when it would only apply to flows with = certain diffserv markings, and doesn=E2=80=99t seem to adjust the target = and interval anyway=E2=80=A6 Well, at some point the intended functionality seems to have got = corrupted, though it could be put back in without difficulty. But I'm = certainly not among LLT's userbase; I put the mode in mostly as a = demonstration that Cake could do it if required. If the originators are = no longer pursuing the proposal, then the mode has no reason to exist = any more. The bulk tin often gets its parameters adjusted, by virtue of the fact = that its threshold is a small fraction of the total. It happens in the = other modes as well. Don't take that as significant. - Jonathan Morton