From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-wm0-x231.google.com (mail-wm0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 54C673BA8E for ; Sun, 26 Nov 2017 13:59:21 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail-wm0-x231.google.com with SMTP id w73so2064505wmw.0 for ; Sun, 26 Nov 2017 10:59:21 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id:references :to; bh=boZET5Jy11C3/MFgoEhZnatK9UNqbQFgzLtk5tzJay4=; b=ODHHppbhZ/9S1zi+rXNopSf8fP4/GbCkF3qDiqQ4DyFENbtgPvj6Czvr+Gewmy7KBN 385ptUy8i8USk95RagxkJzq0+gBvgDvKhWrbD4LoyW/Qmmqmlr69Ltppl2FLFqX3foIY cKBtp1K+/31w9NYxLBBAFssV2G83vxE7NbTXtDMA+CjBZTMI5JVchH02CeYKYUt/19C+ 3wdGli6nWCWI6LvdDAsk7Ap8SlziA2piKc+8pP6a5ZtRM9YRi3zRHTxY2JcjwL0utH/V U6B+UEcgTfIdHDk8QeR0bSq0GKjInDF0ly/V5TsWEi9KmCXjYEzAwO6K+GQpDq0lmkDu uYeg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :message-id:references:to; bh=boZET5Jy11C3/MFgoEhZnatK9UNqbQFgzLtk5tzJay4=; b=WRlG25QpKtSdrrA0v20IzZ2Rbl3DXIC1LLuiMySyy1uDnLIyS608otrUZCvYjnnO6u p+NwexVZ+g7xHGQUDKPSwiLUIcVYRPVEVfkCuHFhl7UQe/qL/LrtHPWrzQ56tDwPyI0n vIoVaRECVPp0OmcQ6+KCjQOa5d1guK7hb9TJinhFeAwOZ07c4XlchWrqz0hdQXkindfO Ru9kbRVHld3iJQs3nLO2xv2YX7jrmtm9vMc63WtlwwtQ34e05Rm+p4ayli2oTzCsvStV mhwj0J0Hn2bxxE+PjiLgIHZ+rSb4Kp01kATWeCPQUnGo4hriWVb+yrRPouVlg6/WZWUN 0yPw== X-Gm-Message-State: AJaThX6uBVRR1Kq6VInF99yGsI590zj22J+MR9hYu0VUuC6qf5dOHfBX RIW0JUifPfocJW2a7YWaXRA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGs4zMYuj61fEy1Fn8VtGBjkXMKFb/XBwdSVaywAluXoIRc7hkb+rAdjpr/FHMygPEPG6AvLXPFrcA== X-Received: by 10.28.58.211 with SMTP id h202mr13786971wma.56.1511722760414; Sun, 26 Nov 2017 10:59:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from [10.72.0.130] (h-1169.lbcfree.net. [185.99.119.68]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id f19sm30030680wrh.64.2017.11.26.10.59.18 (version=TLS1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 26 Nov 2017 10:59:19 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_C064396B-20A8-420D-9DB7-1D564E40D1D2" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) From: Pete Heist In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2017 19:59:21 +0100 Cc: Cake List Message-Id: References: <6BE29FE9-6E32-4324-8B56-6BB3B6E5F033@gmail.com> <8F179D16-9E10-44B3-B84C-8A988DD376F5@gmail.com> To: Dave Taht X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) Subject: Re: [Cake] cake flenter results round 0 X-BeenThere: cake@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Cake - FQ_codel the next generation List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2017 18:59:21 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_C064396B-20A8-420D-9DB7-1D564E40D1D2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > On Nov 26, 2017, at 6:45 PM, Dave Taht wrote: >=20 > the real test of a aqm is how it handles a range of rtts in real = traffic. >=20 > While a simple, useful test is merely to insert delays of say, 20, 40, = 80, 160ms > inline with >=20 > a real test would have multiple tcp targets of those delays. >=20 > The main trick with using netem properly is to not have it be the > bottleneck link, and have a huge packet limit, so it doesn't turn into > your tail loss queue. Ok, I=E2=80=99ll try to keep this in mind when I get to that. >> I=E2=80=99m a little lost as to whether or if I need to be using = net-next, if I can >> just use the current netem I have, where to get the latest netem and = veth / >> namespaces stuff, etc... >=20 > A whole lotta namespace stuff landed in net-next, some of which I was > probably leveraging. >=20 > I kind of need to go heads down this week on finishing up the slotting > feature in iproute2. And looking over the cake codebase there. Got it, I=E2=80=99ll gradually figure this out over time. I=E2=80=99ve = been enjoying the =E2=80=9Csimplicity=E2=80=9D of RTT, OWD and related = stats for a while. Testing queueing can feel like directing runs at the LHC (not that I=E2=80= =99d know). After this is done I think I want to learn some more theory. = Sometimes theoretical discoveries can make years of experimental work = irrelevant (and vice-versa, I guess).= --Apple-Mail=_C064396B-20A8-420D-9DB7-1D564E40D1D2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
On Nov 26, 2017, at 6:45 PM, Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com>= wrote:

the real test of a aqm is how it handles = a range of rtts in real traffic.

While a simple, useful test is merely to insert = delays of say, 20, 40, 80, 160ms
inline with

a real test would have multiple tcp targets of = those delays.

The main trick with = using netem properly is to not have it be the
bottleneck link, = and have a huge packet limit, so it doesn't turn into
your tail loss = queue.

Ok, I=E2=80=99= ll try to keep this in mind when I get to that.

I=E2=80=99m a little lost as to whether or if I need to be = using net-next, if I can
just use the current netem I = have, where to get the latest netem and veth /
namespaces = stuff, etc...

A whole lotta namespace stuff landed in = net-next, some of which I was
probably leveraging.

I kind of need to go heads down this week = on finishing up the slotting
feature in iproute2. And looking over the = cake codebase there.

Got = it, I=E2=80=99ll gradually figure this out over time. I=E2=80=99ve been = enjoying the =E2=80=9Csimplicity=E2=80=9D of RTT, OWD and related stats = for a while.

Testing queueing can feel like directing runs at the LHC (not = that I=E2=80=99d know). After this is done I think I want to learn some = more theory. Sometimes theoretical discoveries can make years of = experimental work irrelevant (and vice-versa, I = guess).
= --Apple-Mail=_C064396B-20A8-420D-9DB7-1D564E40D1D2--