From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.15.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E6E4F3B29D for ; Thu, 13 Jan 2022 10:44:25 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1642088664; bh=r7hMeouqTDtOjc8YzGggO+Gscu7qMZ+R7hWj5JgwZE4=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:References:To; b=aX9bJqKhZm85btOkqhKAt3ea0It0xyosJ4xNvzgtvBXpBK5D3p1S757EY8MSu6eMb wV7bX2K82XaOSYHlY1caxHiu0JZIWtp4iJdHBy/l6QqBl/yokeXj6TtU/18jwfSp0l ndkyjXEUJrEb3NWOWw1I5n1OyK6QqDo6ndUXfp/U= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from smtpclient.apple ([134.76.241.253]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx004 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1My36T-1mPqbf12el-00za4v; Thu, 13 Jan 2022 16:44:24 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.120.0.1.13\)) From: Sebastian Moeller In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2022 16:44:23 +0100 Cc: cerowrt-devel Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <6D533A43-C4E9-4D48-BC9B-26630F1E17F5@gmx.de> To: =?utf-8?Q?Dave_T=C3=A4ht?= X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.120.0.1.13) X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:ZCRODEn1EnWb0HnanO2VQchB3+D1bYSK9PLQD//SVrkTzlyuUVN CMJBRjeTFnL6CLcv69Mtgic2xbodRPmZ7KH1Ft2t5V5VPZjP2m4pHQ6txtqDVhslIgqklwC 1HOSBszNq4pbjKiPtIfJQkk9p9+iarAbjZS8rc5kCGONzMtFAj0UWm9BDsR4We/yBLVrprJ J+cCvBct6ExzHBJcxlxdQ== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:YIq74E3n/mI=:3GE8kPlII+jkEkPS0tiCVD JQgbvMeZjlm+ivmIwEO8ZQ7oDxJ8UIrTq4ZME9EEtnpmwYqEu29T9ZXzuEdzQXa2tBNdbm6Jp Jm8EHh9ziTKa32j0XXzFqWTpodUAWP73/EZ5cvfmbZ25dNc4AUp4yX71fzq/9cRUSPW4eDYgN NmmfT6T3TjiwDaMw40aDFffAjcwyVSDrUar/ONYFVnRlPckmNaEPRWJkMFQBPAVqK63wlf3kR 8Z6RBEJ2NJ5HqM9fPYmJHanBc3YyxMeDbwZHeBkjuTojqppWmyFhzR802BL5K4vUgWcHhJn0t TgbnbTbrqg7Ih/DBxBPoSnySh4Nt+VEBcthwbpWpNBmUqkE4hxm7mpP98jTYZTXexJNTCM+wL pqkgnFAIn9PyA2nZKgZMUCsPq3V+5LYBB/gdWtvSHbUE7m0vjlRX3BtYOSUTm+fLybjGvvYLY SlPmbvAf7eKBPDe1HKF7HKpkfa6PgJv+eSMyl4e0eRZ4t+bxY9+MxVVbcsnl31lgppyuO0fy3 lI5MQ70edgGH9vB8fZCkEGg/y56mjvnsNrclw9MbbQk2xdPrTTN6nrKJyQDZZkYb6bib+o5Qg d3HPH6X+4fKSkvJaLg3nfALqCd+fGms/6cCeeojqk0V1XmQoIkThXIxVkuO9N5ke7bWSVxwZU mjoRMLvTftH4fHchudJ2Q6FIiv9xVlC7LUnn1ppFNBONgT2CNm2z9IG/3vh+plfxAcA5RMAaO 7diyMl5GEFTsDjVRL7qQilRyrWHMtwxam4LTQ4xyerl+QUparsfuwS9+F0Mt7W906rPaxnDyA Vt6jbCtQdVQ52Ib43ynk/LhJuA/82OMqjarfTbRjmBEg/Wj4C40+PkxGEoAAEGXpuVoBRMO4F kADVaij0zTuWf6CsR1BEjbmwHKhehITqyW+YJayfQCrl8J4hI759a1Nr7Ph/3hsBJdUEjskh7 5dJ8fYnWibWkhq0+GYC/GG+bs0SLVWfjP8WUvNgzjPl9G+V3BH5FM7pklViSB+ZeX6UXOwMye 3IrsgIQUDg/8NAWrNIp3/dJU99JVeWwEZ7jFZW+JSTh5qkrihqkpp4k0kic/nvrDiZhMgn8SM 8uHIXsHyRxT7UQ= Subject: Re: [Cerowrt-devel] a smart SFP X-BeenThere: cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Development issues regarding the cerowrt test router project List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2022 15:44:26 -0000 Hi Dave, > On Jan 13, 2022, at 16:28, Dave Taht wrote: >=20 > yes, well, I dislike intensely the implications of > not-so-intelligently splitting those 128 terminals is, and was pleased > to see there was support Nobody in their right mind is going to hook up 128 terminalt to = one OLT port, I hope... > at least, for hardware flow control on the uplink side in the spec. The spec, as many ITU documents contains probably more than = anybody is going to use ;) But GPON uses a request-grant system for upstream scheduling similar to = DOCSIS (when looking at both from great height), just with a much faster = message clock and hence less total and especially less variability in = delay, if I understood things correctly. > Since we've fixed dsl, cable, and wifi, getting gpon more right has > increasingly > been on my mind... Fist question might to be "how broken is GPON/XGPON" to start = with, no? > so pulling a testbed together of some sort would > be cool, and for that matter, having a SFP that could go right into a > SFP enabled home router rather than a separate unit seems like a good > idea, also. Meh, unless you actually get root on the ONU, it will basically = act like a small media converter whether you connect via SFP or via = ethernet. In Germany enthusiasts started to look at SFP-ONUs partly = because ISPs were provisioning more GPON "rate" than required for that = the ~940 Mbps goodput of gigabit ethernet, going SFP allowed some to run = (compatible SFP-onus) at 2.5 Gbps link rate to the SFP cage hence = allowing speedtest superiority... (that and to clone ONUs so you can = have a replacement in the cupboard in case your original dies; typicallY = ONUs need to be individually provisioned by the ISP but if you have a = perfect clone all the ISP would see is a short power-down). The upshot = of this is that some found ways onto SFP onus so you can get more = information from the ONU if you are really dedicated. But first you need = an GPON link and an ISP that will provision whatever ONU you selected... = (ITU envisioned the ONU to be part of the ISPs network and hence little = thought was spend on ideas like giving the end user root on those = devices). And that is where I am out, currently FTTH-built out is a big = topic at home, but has not reached my flat yet and might not for a few = years (oh, the irony, as I am living literally next door to a central = office of the incumbent telco, spanning a fiber cable over less then 20 = m should get me FTTH, but I digress) Regards Sebastian >=20 >=20 > On Thu, Jan 13, 2022 at 6:51 AM Sebastian Moeller = wrote: >>=20 >> Yes sorry, >>=20 >> in GPON you have the unit at the telco side, often called OLT = (optical line termination/terminal or similar, which feeds the whole = segment of up to ~128 remote terminals and receives data from all) the = passive splitter (if any) and the remote customer units that are called = either ONU or ONT, but that are just two names for the same unit (not = sure who uses which nomenclature, the local incumbent seems to prefer = ONU, but their marketing name is Glasfasermodem, which just translates = to fiber-modem). Nomenclature seems ot be consistent for the whole PON = family, so in XG-PON or XGS-PON the unit apparently still are called OLT = and ONU/ONT. And given that PON requires some smarts and configurability = of the ONUs these tend to be small computers in their own right with = their own little (or not so little) OSes. >>=20 >> Regards >> Sebastian >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>> On Jan 13, 2022, at 15:38, Dave Taht wrote: >>>=20 >>> And a gpon onu >>>=20 >>> https://www.fs.com/products/133619.html >>>=20 >>> On Thu, Jan 13, 2022 at 6:23 AM Sebastian Moeller = wrote: >>>>=20 >>>> That is similar to what happens in some GPON-ONT SFPs, some run a = full small Linux distribution like OpenWrt inside.... though for = ethernet that is unexpected. >>>> This is also similar to SFP VDSL "modems" which likely run their = own embedded OS as well inside the SFP package (at a time there was even = a PCI VDSL2 "modem" that was actually running its own embedded system on = the PCI board, IIRC, it pretended to the main computer to be an ethernet = NIC). >>>>=20 >>>> Regards >>>> Sebastian >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>>> On Jan 13, 2022, at 15:18, Dave Taht wrote: >>>>>=20 >>>>> running linux, of course. >>>>>=20 >>>>> https://blog.benjojo.co.uk/post/smart-sfp-linux-inside >>>>>=20 >>>>> -- >>>>> I tried to build a better future, a few times: >>>>> https://wayforward.archive.org/?site=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.icei.org >>>>>=20 >>>>> Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Cerowrt-devel mailing list >>>>> Cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net >>>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/cerowrt-devel >>>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> -- >>> I tried to build a better future, a few times: >>> https://wayforward.archive.org/?site=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.icei.org >>>=20 >>> Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC >>=20 >=20 >=20 > --=20 > I tried to build a better future, a few times: > https://wayforward.archive.org/?site=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.icei.org >=20 > Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC