From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from uplift.swm.pp.se (ipv6.swm.pp.se [IPv6:2a00:801::f]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 27E0D21F2ED for ; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 00:01:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by uplift.swm.pp.se (Postfix, from userid 501) id 704F4A3; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 09:01:11 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=swm.pp.se; s=mail; t=1410332471; bh=6W797CRH9OGU9vDruinQhjXvyXl/LKThFV91HSOiw4c=; h=Date:From:To:cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=t0STfGixSJZebP1x8z+P+aNXmOish9MzzuOHbBXilXjNGp5KNpFtthM4e7KYgWtxr 6YXHFueRv9N1+a/N9jZ8FE+7BJG7Fl/qycTMz2YSP2mP8sTDhHaP9yx6jSn7Rwjbnl KoC3SgkXkT+5S54qf0K2XzSK2/66LsShBl8HCUQc= Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by uplift.swm.pp.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68573A2; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 09:01:11 +0200 (CEST) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2014 09:01:11 +0200 (CEST) From: Mikael Abrahamsson To: Dave Taht In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <1410279963.30013719@apps.rackspace.com> User-Agent: Alpine 2.02 (DEB 1266 2009-07-14) Organization: People's Front Against WWW MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: Wes Felter , "cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net" , =?UTF-8?Q?Joel_Wir=C4=81mu_Pauling?= Subject: Re: [Cerowrt-devel] 10GigE nics and SFP+ modules? X-BeenThere: cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Development issues regarding the cerowrt test router project List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2014 07:01:42 -0000 On Tue, 9 Sep 2014, Dave Taht wrote: > I have been a big advocate of municipal fiber, but have not had a good > handle on the costs involved. I have generally heard it's 80% labor, > 20% materials, and the cost of fiber cabling alone, at least at retail > is kind of intimidating. I'd say this depends on the market, considering such things as "how much does it cost to dig up the street", labor cost per hour etc. If you're looking at last-mile in dense high-rises, I'd say fiber cabling doesn't cost that much more than copper, but what costs is that for fiber, the operator has to provide a CPE and make sure there is power nearby. I did a procurement of this for my condo with 750 apartments and compared FTTH and CTTH and CTTH is cheaper, but also more bulky and requires to have switches all over the place, whereas FTTH means you can aggregate all apartments in a single place. Cost of indoor copper cabling alone here in Sweden was around 100USD per apartment. Fiber was more expensive both in materials and labor, but not hugely so. What drives the cost of fiber was the cost of the media converters and the power cabling to the media converters or the alternative, cabling within apartments to get the fiber to where there was power and at the same time convenient for the user to have the media converter. All in all, in highrises, I'd say it's approximately 50% cost of labor+cabling for the physical cabling needed (power+fiber), and then another 50% for equipment (media converter and aggregation equipment). Total cost of install was around 150 USD per apartment for copper and 300-400 USD per apartment for fiber. For houses, this is of course very different, since digging is involved. Digging is very expensive. If you ever dig, put in ducts. Large ducts, and lots of them. Typical cost of FTTH in Sweden to houses, (and now we're talking fairly dense developments with 500-1000sqm lots next to each other with one house on each), is around 2500 USD per house. > I see a lot of tradeoffs being made with GPON that for example, single > mode fiber deployments such as amsterdam's didn't make. > http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2010/03/how-amsterdam-was-wired-for-open-access-fiber/ > - and kind of concerned about the "bumps in the wire" there. I don't like when people create their cable plant to match what GPON needs. It's done because of the illusion that long-haul fiber is expensive. It isn't, if you have to dig anyway. The difference in cost of a 12 fiber cable, and a 1000 fiber cable, isn't huge compared to the digging costs. Splicing a 1000 fiber cable isn't huge either. Point-to-point fiber cabling is the way to go. If you then decide to light it up using PON of some kind, fine, that's up to you, at least you have the flexibility to change technology in the future. > and several costs there have dropped significantly, routerboard is > making a SFP+ capable > 5 port switch for like 50 dollars URL? -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se