From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from bifrost.lang.hm (mail.lang.hm [64.81.33.126]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DA3F121F204; Tue, 12 May 2015 15:17:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from asgard.lang.hm (asgard.lang.hm [10.0.0.100]) by bifrost.lang.hm (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3) with ESMTP id t4CMHYx7022492; Tue, 12 May 2015 15:17:34 -0700 Date: Tue, 12 May 2015 15:17:34 -0700 (PDT) From: David Lang X-X-Sender: dlang@asgard.lang.hm To: Dave Taht In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: User-Agent: Alpine 2.02 (DEB 1266 2009-07-14) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="680960-1287533958-1431469054=:644" Cc: "cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net" , bloat Subject: Re: [Cerowrt-devel] better business bufferbloat monitoring tools? X-BeenThere: cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Development issues regarding the cerowrt test router project List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 May 2015 22:18:24 -0000 This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. --680960-1287533958-1431469054=:644 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT On Tue, 12 May 2015, Dave Taht wrote: > One thread bothering me on dslreports.com is that some folk seem to > think you only get bufferbloat if you stress test the network, where > transient bufferbloat is happening all the time, everywhere. > > On one of my main sqm'd network gateways, day in, day out, it reports > about 6000 drops or ecn marks on ingress, and about 300 on egress. > Before I doubled the bandwidth that main box got, the drop rate used > to be much higher, and a great deal of the bloat, drops, etc, has now > moved into the wifi APs deeper into the network where I am not > monitoring it effectively. > > I would love to see tools like mrtg, cacti, nagios and smokeping[1] be > more closely integrated, with bloat related plugins, and in > particular, as things like fq_codel and other ecn enabled aqms deploy, > start also tracking congestive events like loss and ecn CE markings on > the bandwidth tracking graphs. > > This would counteract to some extent the classic 5 minute bandwidth > summaries everyone looks at, that hide real traffic bursts, latencies > and loss at sub 5 minute timescales. The problem is that too many people don't realize that network utilization is never 50%, it's always 0% or 100% (if you look at a small enough timeslice). With a 5 min ave, 20% utilization could be 100% maxed out and buffering for 60 seconds, and then idle for the remainder of the time. I always set my graphs for 1 min samples (and am very tempted to go shorter) just because 5 min hides so much. David Lang > mrtg and cacti rely on snmp. While loss statistics are deeply part of > snmp, I am not aware of there being a mib for CE events and a quick > google search was unrevealing. ? > > There is also a need for more cross-network monitoring using tools > such as that done by this excellent paper. > > http://www.caida.org/publications/papers/2014/measurement_analysis_internet_interconnection/measurement_analysis_internet_interconnection.pdf > > [1] the network monitoring tools market is quite vast and has many > commercial applications, like intermapper, forks of nagios, vendor > specific producs from cisco, etc, etc. Far too many to list, and so > far as I know, none are reporting ECN related stats, nor combining > latency and loss with bandwidth graphs. I would love to know if any > products, commercial or open source, did.... > > -- > Dave Täht > Open Networking needs **Open Source Hardware** > > https://plus.google.com/u/0/+EricRaymond/posts/JqxCe2pFr67 > _______________________________________________ > Cerowrt-devel mailing list > Cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/cerowrt-devel --680960-1287533958-1431469054=:644--