From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from uplift.swm.pp.se (swm.pp.se [212.247.200.143]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CEF7C3CB3D for ; Wed, 14 Feb 2018 06:33:22 -0500 (EST) Received: by uplift.swm.pp.se (Postfix, from userid 501) id 5A6DCB1; Wed, 14 Feb 2018 12:33:21 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=swm.pp.se; s=mail; t=1518608001; bh=T2pZDn0m/+uQCNsDka7aRxwHDVBHT2+StJ/xT2epsc4=; h=Date:From:To:cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=v9IikCKMEfABslkL7POmqZdMv7b6M8ePy9f4Aild1KXwDO9PCwb7JbTJBep9rSynU 4mCp92PrNj/bIxNSzaCijyKUQUZrjBq7GVwLsUPy0IBEHeEc311LHo9ghhPLoKPzkh NSpi7aRh/j71Y0sQDxtHGiCtffHPO3Qi8mdVa5uQ= Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by uplift.swm.pp.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 587EEB0; Wed, 14 Feb 2018 12:33:21 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2018 12:33:21 +0100 (CET) From: Mikael Abrahamsson To: =?UTF-8?Q?Joel_Wir=C4=81mu_Pauling?= cc: cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: User-Agent: Alpine 2.20 (DEB 67 2015-01-07) Organization: People's Front Against WWW MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; BOUNDARY="-137064504-693913775-1518608001=:3478" Subject: Re: [Cerowrt-devel] LCA 2018 talk available X-BeenThere: cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Development issues regarding the cerowrt test router project List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2018 11:33:23 -0000 This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. ---137064504-693913775-1518608001=:3478 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT On Thu, 25 Jan 2018, Joel Wirāmu Pauling wrote: > Kia Ora (Hi in Māori). > > Today I delivered my talk on 10Gbit(+) in the home at Linuxconf > Australasia. Some specific shout outs to those on the list who helped form > some of the content and especially for the continued efforts with FLENT > which I have been making extensive use of both professionally and privately. > > Hopefully this is of some interest and use to people on the list. > > https://github.com/aenertia/lca2018-talk/tree/talk Great presentation, thanks. Some feedback. I have been told MOCA is widely used in USA, and this is in-house coax cabling used for providing IP based services in multiple rooms. http://www.instructables.com/id/How-to-set-up-a-coax-MoCA-network/ Now, this doesn't have much to do with your 10GE talk as it's not going to be that fast, but anyway. So back to > 1GE speeds. It seems to me that 1GE is good enough for a lot of user needs. It's over 100 megabyte/s, most HDDs won't even transfer faster than this. Most devices do not have anything faster than 1GE, so it's a chicken and egg problem. I have a 100EUR fanless managable 24 port switch with 4 SFP ports. I imagine anything faster than this would require fans and would bring up the cost a lot. It would be ideal to have a 24 port 1GE + 4 (or 8) ports of 1/2.5/5/10GE for incremental migration, but I have 0 things in my home that speaks anything faster than 1GBASE-T (with RJ45 connector). I do have SFP+ based NIC cards and DAC cables, but I don't even use them (apart from occasional testing). The upgrade was from 100BASE-T to 1GBASE-T was fairly cheap and addressed a wide need, since 10-11 megabyte/s was slower than most HDDs even 15-20 years ago. Today, 100-110megabyte/s at 1GBASE-T speeds is actually still quite decent, and most people don't have huge amounts of data to move around. So for most people, anything faster than 1GBASE-T doesn't address a problem they actually have. Yes, for people handling 4k footage and doing video editing etc, they need faster. But most people don't. For them a 8-24 port 1GBASE-T switch is fine, and provides a networking solution that is not bottlenecking them in any significant fashion. 2.5G and 5G would be a good compromise, but it seems to be stuck in chicken/egg problem space. Most people actually don't even wire their computers today, it's all wifi, and even if they do wire them, the only NIC available is 1GBASE-T based. The iMac Pro is the first prosumer device I have seen that actually supports faster networking. If Apple or someone else actually released a thunderbolt based NIC that was decently sized/priced that did support 2.5G or 5GBASE-T, then this chicken/egg problem could perhaps be solved. Most people don't feel the need to connect these kinds of things to their laptop: https://www.startech.com/uk/Networking-IO/Adapter-Cards/thunderbolt-3-10-gbe-nic-chassis~BNDTB310GNDP https://www.akitio.com/adapters/thunder2-10g-network-adapter https://www.promise.com/Products/SANLink/SANLink2/10G-BaseT http://www.tehutinetworks.net/?t=LV&L1=3&L2=0&L3=0&L7=157 is interesting, as this is not huge. It also does 2.5G and 5G. https://www.anandtech.com/show/12422/akitios-thunder3-10g-adapter-now-available 300USD is still a significant chunk of money compared to the 29USD 1GBASE-T thunderbolt2 adapter that Apple sells. But still, with these kinds of products, there might be hope! -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se ---137064504-693913775-1518608001=:3478--