From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from uplift.swm.pp.se (ipv6.swm.pp.se [IPv6:2a00:801::f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 43D0D3CB3E for ; Wed, 14 Feb 2018 08:21:13 -0500 (EST) Received: by uplift.swm.pp.se (Postfix, from userid 501) id AA1C5B1; Wed, 14 Feb 2018 14:21:11 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=swm.pp.se; s=mail; t=1518614471; bh=XZh6EMAHiBg9EwobOwVteJEK6SLvjNeRVWcJOUHuql8=; h=Date:From:To:cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=HHCDP7WVNVJFf6NWo2qgVH2UjyINO8Fz9FeBHWCBs9ZZQdpRV3fxP2xptBrV7EEhG Bu0U0GBdMsYXzbR7El01qjua+OKirmQJkKRmDJipjtP/Q/qBGKA28/5OA1pMKelKQQ uYs3gd+mTERUsyi4kwUs+eznbZhLFnoeCfGGMNbI= Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by uplift.swm.pp.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6369B0; Wed, 14 Feb 2018 14:21:11 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2018 14:21:11 +0100 (CET) From: Mikael Abrahamsson To: =?UTF-8?Q?Joel_Wir=C4=81mu_Pauling?= cc: cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: User-Agent: Alpine 2.20 (DEB 67 2015-01-07) Organization: People's Front Against WWW MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; BOUNDARY="-137064504-747358476-1518614471=:3478" Subject: Re: [Cerowrt-devel] LCA 2018 talk available X-BeenThere: cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Development issues regarding the cerowrt test router project List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2018 13:21:13 -0000 This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. ---137064504-747358476-1518614471=:3478 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT On Thu, 15 Feb 2018, Joel Wirāmu Pauling wrote: > Again it's not the speed, it's the throughput. TB3 delivers near to what > my local x86 can do in terms of throughput. Also network should never be > slower than disc. Since NVME has been around this is no-longer true. > It's an unnatural order of things. Having done networking since mid 80-ties, having the network be slower than disk has been the reality, forever, for me. The only time this might not have been true would be in the beginning of 1GBASE time, where single HDDs were slower than network. With in 10BASE-2 days, HDDs were doing a magnitude higher transfer speeds compared to network. Running NFS was slow compared to local drive. > Cabling is the issue in my mind right now. Every laptop with tb3 ports > has 10G+ capability, if passive optical long run was cheap and easily > available for tb3 then half the problem would already be solved. Cabling fiber is unfortunately always quite a lot harder and more complicated than copper, that's why RJ45 won. Having factory-made fiber cable with USB-C connectors at each end might work, if the active electronics can be made small enough. Think pulling these through holes in walls, through cable management etc. Unfortunately I doubt these will reach enough volume in near time to really become widely used due to their initial high cost. > Maybe 10G over cat6a will be ok as the evolution. But you have to go to > cat8 to get anything beyond 10G... so the cabling situation and > incentive to upgrade to future-proof isn't there. If we need higher than 10G speeds, then yes, fiber is the next natural evolution. I don't know how we're going to make single-mode fiber something that the average user can handle without problems. There are advantages though. I am getting FTTH now. The cable they're putting is looks like this: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10154951833141595&set=p.10154951833141595&type=3&theater It has 3 strands and it's single mode. So if we can light up these at a good cost/power/size compromise, the cables can be made extremely thin. Still wondering how the connectors etc are going to look like to make this end user friendly. -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se ---137064504-747358476-1518614471=:3478--