From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-iy0-f171.google.com (mail-iy0-f171.google.com [209.85.210.171]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority" (verified OK)) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3104E200B10; Sat, 17 Dec 2011 00:30:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by iagw33 with SMTP id w33so6123615iag.16 for ; Sat, 17 Dec 2011 00:30:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=hCdZGwpi6tK5xvC4Hc/Z2+EI7DnkVLbaa7evrsUcOqg=; b=k3aaVbQZy2DmdTW6ZgSHnaLeiwd4Yd5dd30qN8M0eey5epvmCAwJxyryPEDNHctGVe h8AIfsGKlTQzj2BUPUad3jo92RbSfUrWiJFS0iYNjgtT70w7WzFZSCrgy76CPw8pprEB VjLbTxk4aYD9lXVsjNc+kJIqAOe10bBrXgPkE= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.85.197 with SMTP id j5mr13650576igz.32.1324110605795; Sat, 17 Dec 2011 00:30:05 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.231.204.83 with HTTP; Sat, 17 Dec 2011 00:30:05 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2011 09:30:05 +0100 Message-ID: From: Dave Taht To: Maxim Kharlamov Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: cerowrt-users@lists.bufferbloat.net, cerowrt@lists.bufferbloat.net, Jim Reisert AD1C , Stephen Walker , cerowrt-devel@lists.bufferbloat.net Subject: Re: [Cerowrt-users] engaging developers and users [#314] X-BeenThere: cerowrt-users@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Support for user problems regarding cerowrt List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2011 08:30:07 -0000 On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 10:07 AM, Maxim Kharlamov wrote= : > Hello Dave, > > I'm running cerowrt on day-to-day basis on my wndr3800 for quite a while = and > it works like a charm. It is rc7-smoketest10 build. Managed to configure > everything I needed apart from dyndns client which is not a big issue > anyway. I should probably point people at that build as a 'stable' release, with tw= o known bugs (notably having to manually create the radios). We were very close with that smoketest! (but shortly afterwards the build, the kernel, the driver, bind, ntp, and a= hcp all broke simultaneously, as did I. There was a ton of churn upstream, that is only now settling down) So in the future, I need to come up with a good point to do a code freeze in the release cycle. This is of course, in conflict with the idea of close= ly tracking the kernel and openwrt development process, > So far wndr3800+cerowrt is the best performer out of many routers I tried= . I > tested wndr3800 stock, linksys e3000 and e4200 with stock and tomatousb, > pfsense 2.0 appliance, cradlepoint mbr1400 and some others. Speedtest on > wndr3800+cerowrt is constantly at or almost at the top of the list and > during the speed test ping times are not deteriorating as badly as for th= e > other routers. Feature-wise cerowrt is also the best (for my particular > setup), so currently it is my main router at home even though initially I > bought it for playing and testing. Excellent! Thank you. Preliminary testing indicated that andrews/felix's fixes for bugs 216 and 1= 95 got us to where openwrt was outperforming the factory firmware in most respects... ... but I immediately turned around and started sacrificing that raw transf= er performance for lower latency. (reduced tx rings, txqueues) I'd like to think that that, also, improved performance by a few metrics, b= ut I don't plan on resuming serious testing on various benchmarks until after this coming development cycle is well underway. In that effort thus far I've enabled a ton of debugging code to be able to look more closely at the effects on cpu of various AQM technologies, and what I have working at the moment just barely boots. > I've just received another wndr3800 and going to install openwrt on it to > compare them side-by-side and to have a playground for routers. The core difference here at this point between cerowrt and openwrt is the v= astly reduced tx rings and txqueues - you can add these into openwrt easily by ed= iting /etc/init.d/boot to run ethtool at the right time, and adding /etc/hotplug.d/iface/00-debloat to openwrt. I note I plan serious improvements to the basic debloat script there adding some intelligence to it - in the upcoming development cycle. > > Overall, excellent job, Dave! I'm keeping my eye on cerowrt. Thx again. Sometimes all I can see are the outstanding problems, rather than the good stuff. > > > Thanks, > Max > > > On 15 December 2011 18:14, Dave Taht wrote: >> >> our anti-phishing system kicked back on the numeric urls in this, fixed >> now. >> >> The reason why cerowrt lives on the 172 dot 30 dot 42 dot X address is >> that it had been my hope that others working on this project would plug >> *two* routers into their home network - one for the day-to-day effort of >> keeping their internet access up and running (on 192 dot 168 dot zero do= t >> one), and a cerowrt box for analyzing both routers behavior. >> >> *I* don't run it as my day-to-day device at the moment. From where I sit= , >> it's a test tool - an increasingly good one - for coming up with solutio= ns >> to bufferbloat, and fixing the whole home router disaster with things li= ke >> ipv6, proxying, dns, etc... it has oprofile, and debugging tools by defa= ult, >> etc, etc. >> >> I had planned to get to where we had stable releases that could be used >> day-to-day, but it's been a while since we had one, and I feel that we'r= e >> going to make some progress on the core bufferbloat problem next quarter= , >> and not have a stable release. >> >> I'm GLAD to have users and testers - some generations of cerowrt are >> running for people like jg, esr, & each, and have enormous stability and >> uptimes - I don't know who else is running a generation of cerowrt >> day-to-day frankly, there's been a lot of downloads - but there will alw= ays >> be something broken in a smoketest or rc, that may not be able to be fix= ed >> very quickly. Or something crazy we're doing - like routing vs bridging = - >> that exposes a problem that we needed to know about.... >> >> Recently, that happened with samba. And while I hope that's fixed now (i= n >> a couple ways - wins appears to be working, and I also have a largely >> untested samba 3.6.1 package, it needs to get tested at some point in ne= xt >> year's development cycle) >> >> http://www.bufferbloat.net/issues/314 >> http://www.bufferbloat.net/issues/303 >> >> I'd really like to use samba again personally, I used to use it a lot. >> These days I tend to use sshfs, and that's zillions of times slower than >> samba. >> >> Having a user support community and people testing release candidates an= d >> smoketests is very important to me, too! I LOVED finding out how to make >> samba work right... >> >> So, high on my list is coming up with a proper way of stressing what's o= n >> the front page of the documentation, and setting (low!) expectations, an= d >> keeping people engaged... >> >> From: http://cero2.bufferbloat.net/cerowrt/ >> >> "CeroWrt is an OpenWrt router platform for use by individuals, >> researchers, and students interested in advancing the state of the art o= n >> the Internet. Specifically, it is aimed at investigating the problems of >> latency under load, bufferbloat, wireless-n, QoS, and the effects of var= ious >> TCP algorithms on shared networks." >> >> If there is some place in the doc where we are not putting up large >> warning signs - 'BUGS AHEAD. DANGEROUS CODE. DON'T EXPERIMENT WITH THIS = ON >> WIVES OR CHILDREN' - I'd to find it and fix it. >> >> I'm perfectly happy with the hardware and core software itself at this >> point. I wasn't, this time last year. >> >> I'd like everybody in the open source and network research communities t= o >> get TWO routers based on this chipset for christmas! Use one day to day, >> running openwrt, and the other experimenting with a future outlined by t= he >> ideas in cerowrt. >> >> 1) I'd like to come up with a good way for people to plug this in as a >> 'secondary' router. >> >> Right now that requires turning off nat, and telling the upstream router >> to give the cerowrt router a static ip and route to the 172 dot 30 dot 4= 2 >> dot 0 slash 24 address. Perhaps we can take some screenshots of how to d= o >> that on more common CPE? >> >> Network renumbering involves running a couple line sed script. >> >> http://www.bufferbloat.net/projects/cerowrt/wiki/Default_network_numberi= ng >> >> I hope to make renumbering a router easier with a gui, but you know, it'= s >> a 3 line sed script and a couple hundred lines of gui to write to make t= hat >> easier. >> I'm also thinking of merely writing an RFC standardizing that 192 dot 16= 8 >> dot zero dot 1 should be the number ALL routers come up on, and the numb= er >> all home networks should use. For april 1st. >> >> Bridging is also possible... but not very. >> >> 2) Another thought is to do builds of the ceropackages repository for >> straight openwrt, and point people at that for things like the bleeding = edge >> samba stuff. >> >> I like ceropackages, it's a good way to spin up and debug a new package, >> with a low barrier to entry for new people to openwrt - after which it h= as >> always been my intent to push the stable stuff upstream. Multiple grad >> students have used the ceropackages concept to get up to speed somewhat = and >> steve walker's been great about polishing those up. (and also submitting >> packages of his own) >> >> 3) Is to more aggressively push up the stuff that works into std openwrt= . >> This is currently blocked by something stupid >> >> http://www.bufferbloat.net/issues/319 >> >> or convince someone to push the stable stuff up to openwrt on a regular >> basis. >> >> 5) Increase the number of people doing active development and able to fi= x >> bugs and documentation. >> >> Any other ideas as to accomplish these mutually incompatable goals - gai= n >> developers, increase the userbase, gain testers,get good day to day and = long >> term resolve, solve bufferbloat, establish world peace, and be able to d= o >> bleeding edge R&D... are welcomed. >> >> I do not ever want to disappoint people with our efforts, and will work >> diligently at fixing every problem exposed by the new stuff we're doing.= One >> of my first thoughts was pretty simple in this area though - try to do l= ess >> new stuff! >> >> -- >> Dave T=E4ht >> SKYPE: davetaht >> US Tel: 1-239-829-5608 >> FR Tel: 0638645374 >> http://www.bufferbloat.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Cerowrt-users mailing list >> Cerowrt-users@lists.bufferbloat.net >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/cerowrt-users >> > > > > -- > Thanks, > Max > --=20 Dave T=E4ht SKYPE: davetaht US Tel: 1-239-829-5608 FR Tel: 0638645374 http://www.bufferbloat.net