From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-pb0-f43.google.com (mail-pb0-f43.google.com [209.85.160.43]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority" (verified OK)) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7401F2022B7 for ; Sat, 4 Aug 2012 20:07:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pbcwz7 with SMTP id wz7so7164130pbc.16 for ; Sat, 04 Aug 2012 20:07:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=content-type:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=B2E2IRH8bLbMLygrypmJD7B9Vf3prI7NEiLER6HIFuk=; b=fRQm0r5oTDsArDafJSUSIEdYdm5qjNJL3DvxTLsz2FywSn0GUhO/sJkGgyUp0IBCNQ /whNZ+XIBmg5M7+wr51uClunRpi7VSDvM2D9dUJalERNCdd3nPkeywqvkY1EwpThz7fJ BB1azHrpFy8MSnaSYc2OJAZo/sh9ZdRfsMEneoAJv2nSAV5VOmh66QCX6uQLBePMjSOS eZNK+wTciZlec+qH2aL0m7AmpDdDTDusFy9+WNEVrOAGjfaFyl7JKVZ4ctFvZGQviVni HbbqwwJ/9q/cKHmw/v9bqZ/ycE8oNu2Bj7X8miBhGADz2gB88Ct4aDD6A1zhbLWyGBhu CDeg== Received: by 10.68.236.67 with SMTP id us3mr8665153pbc.80.1344136023708; Sat, 04 Aug 2012 20:07:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.104] (74-95-2-169-SFBA.hfc.comcastbusiness.net. [74.95.2.169]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id ru10sm2622325pbc.50.2012.08.04.20.07.00 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sat, 04 Aug 2012 20:07:01 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_921BE8F8-60F6-4BAE-8960-3903151EFDE8"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.0 \(1485\)) From: Andrew McGregor In-Reply-To: <501D99C4.20902@pollere.com> Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2012 20:06:55 -0700 Message-Id: <7EB59257-1A8E-4567-8AD3-5016594565CC@gmail.com> References: <1344048299-26267-1-git-send-email-dave.taht@bufferbloat.net> <1344062738.9299.1453.camel@edumazet-glaptop> <501D99C4.20902@pollere.com> To: Kathleen Nichols X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1485) Cc: codel@lists.bufferbloat.net Subject: Re: [Codel] [RFC PATCH] codel: ecn mark at target X-BeenThere: codel@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: CoDel AQM discussions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 05 Aug 2012 03:07:05 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_921BE8F8-60F6-4BAE-8960-3903151EFDE8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Well, thanks Eric for trying it. Hmm. How was I that wrong? Because I was supporting that idea. Time to think. On 4/08/2012, at 2:53 PM, Kathleen Nichols wrote: >=20 > Yes, why would a single delay of more than target be considered > as a reason to take action? I thought Van did a very nice job of > explaining this last Monday. >=20 > On 8/3/12 11:45 PM, Eric Dumazet wrote: >> On Fri, 2012-08-03 at 19:44 -0700, Dave T=E4ht wrote: >>> From: Dave Taht >>>=20 >>> The consensus at ietf was that ecn marking should start at >>> target, and then the results fed into the codel drop scheduler. >>>=20 >>> While I agree with the latter, I feel that waiting an interval >>> before starting to mark will be more in-tune with the concept >>> of a sojourn time, and lead to better utilization. >>>=20 >>> As I am outnumbered and outgunned, do it at target. >>=20 >> Well, thats a huge way to favor non ECN flows against ECN flows. >>=20 >> Marking _all_ ECN enabled packets just because last packet sent had a >> sojourn time above target is going to throttle ECN flows and let non = ECN >> flows going full speed and take whole bandwidth. >>=20 >> Doing so is a nice way to keep users switching to ECN one day. >>=20 >> IETF could just say : ECN is doomed, forget about it, dont even try.=20= >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Codel mailing list >> Codel@lists.bufferbloat.net >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/codel >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Codel mailing list > Codel@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/codel --Apple-Mail=_921BE8F8-60F6-4BAE-8960-3903151EFDE8 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIFLjCCBSow ggQSoAMCAQICEQDMQ2ZKvgsUYA5oQg5SjWfVMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEBBQUAMIGTMQswCQYDVQQGEwJH QjEbMBkGA1UECBMSR3JlYXRlciBNYW5jaGVzdGVyMRAwDgYDVQQHEwdTYWxmb3JkMRowGAYDVQQK ExFDT01PRE8gQ0EgTGltaXRlZDE5MDcGA1UEAxMwQ09NT0RPIENsaWVudCBBdXRoZW50aWNhdGlv biBhbmQgU2VjdXJlIEVtYWlsIENBMB4XDTExMTAwMTAwMDAwMFoXDTEyMDkzMDIzNTk1OVowJTEj MCEGCSqGSIb3DQEJARYUYW5kcmV3bWNnckBnbWFpbC5jb20wggEiMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEBAQUAA4IB DwAwggEKAoIBAQC+buTRxzSXTQmMyUqaokLJit3xU5WVudxHijhKbGRSTgJ867L/v8+rNhSoFwCV MdKIu/M7apWgGkkA+MT/LjDFj63jLT+4nTTLIojXZdoezbpp/rQ2ViSbi54AjhZBQ5X+yH2xcXmG KpDhZjeZC1bvKNvBtdOHCAcrx1Ys1BNj+AhwridEX/KD0cq5xSsJhjDggF6XSUOsaiqBHR6fiQMi 7gH8EuFBh83oklb/pdreg1fQ7gKJk/Me/atIbE1gtbIR88oaCtXoHfZxgkFwagwMtBHdkxN+wcZy 9xx78el9Lxrjx2nMq50hRlj/bqg/m4rSox7//DKfx7bfKNZAiSMDAgMBAAGjggHkMIIB4DAfBgNV HSMEGDAWgBR6E04AdFvGeGNkJ8Ev4qBbvHnFezAdBgNVHQ4EFgQUXOXqNkq6sNbrD8B41dPko8Gs JucwDgYDVR0PAQH/BAQDAgWgMAwGA1UdEwEB/wQCMAAwIAYDVR0lBBkwFwYIKwYBBQUHAwQGCysG AQQBsjEBAwUCMBEGCWCGSAGG+EIBAQQEAwIFIDBGBgNVHSAEPzA9MDsGDCsGAQQBsjEBAgEBATAr MCkGCCsGAQUFBwIBFh1odHRwczovL3NlY3VyZS5jb21vZG8ubmV0L0NQUzBXBgNVHR8EUDBOMEyg SqBIhkZodHRwOi8vY3JsLmNvbW9kb2NhLmNvbS9DT01PRE9DbGllbnRBdXRoZW50aWNhdGlvbmFu ZFNlY3VyZUVtYWlsQ0EuY3JsMIGIBggrBgEFBQcBAQR8MHowUgYIKwYBBQUHMAKGRmh0dHA6Ly9j cnQuY29tb2RvY2EuY29tL0NPTU9ET0NsaWVudEF1dGhlbnRpY2F0aW9uYW5kU2VjdXJlRW1haWxD QS5jcnQwJAYIKwYBBQUHMAGGGGh0dHA6Ly9vY3NwLmNvbW9kb2NhLmNvbTAfBgNVHREEGDAWgRRh bmRyZXdtY2dyQGdtYWlsLmNvbTANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQUFAAOCAQEAgmf81vnsAnbcmIAyyqvEKxAK jRHerfreN10DK1ISkUJ//U4uffQV8sAGDtyIErzVFsW6NYRmFCMSE20M1ffbFpWUmXCtm/YTlkf1 5STVjTMNshDzMDhpjx99Z2J5RBJPZpXjwmpQnfKwB7zft9TcUSIb9FvZm33EKdF/XlS12U4Q9fsj 2shZf88RituX2+fCWfHoTWiFEhFUkLRtWf1YpgHpEXr82nqROxs/aWNlqtLnwTTu2ULr/WpUaRDs kom8gFZkMgw5kRfLpSXRrCFSORsZzkH2ooRxaJY7wMwZaCUS1am9DuwVy7gehoc3ZsjsDkMObZeu kx7Cg7GxIkgo+zGCA64wggOqAgEBMIGpMIGTMQswCQYDVQQGEwJHQjEbMBkGA1UECBMSR3JlYXRl ciBNYW5jaGVzdGVyMRAwDgYDVQQHEwdTYWxmb3JkMRowGAYDVQQKExFDT01PRE8gQ0EgTGltaXRl ZDE5MDcGA1UEAxMwQ09NT0RPIENsaWVudCBBdXRoZW50aWNhdGlvbiBhbmQgU2VjdXJlIEVtYWls IENBAhEAzENmSr4LFGAOaEIOUo1n1TAJBgUrDgMCGgUAoIIB2TAYBgkqhkiG9w0BCQMxCwYJKoZI hvcNAQcBMBwGCSqGSIb3DQEJBTEPFw0xMjA4MDUwMzA2NTVaMCMGCSqGSIb3DQEJBDEWBBQyWdpj iopBSWSCvsdncc/+0mxT+jCBugYJKwYBBAGCNxAEMYGsMIGpMIGTMQswCQYDVQQGEwJHQjEbMBkG A1UECBMSR3JlYXRlciBNYW5jaGVzdGVyMRAwDgYDVQQHEwdTYWxmb3JkMRowGAYDVQQKExFDT01P RE8gQ0EgTGltaXRlZDE5MDcGA1UEAxMwQ09NT0RPIENsaWVudCBBdXRoZW50aWNhdGlvbiBhbmQg U2VjdXJlIEVtYWlsIENBAhEAzENmSr4LFGAOaEIOUo1n1TCBvAYLKoZIhvcNAQkQAgsxgayggakw gZMxCzAJBgNVBAYTAkdCMRswGQYDVQQIExJHcmVhdGVyIE1hbmNoZXN0ZXIxEDAOBgNVBAcTB1Nh bGZvcmQxGjAYBgNVBAoTEUNPTU9ETyBDQSBMaW1pdGVkMTkwNwYDVQQDEzBDT01PRE8gQ2xpZW50 IEF1dGhlbnRpY2F0aW9uIGFuZCBTZWN1cmUgRW1haWwgQ0ECEQDMQ2ZKvgsUYA5oQg5SjWfVMA0G CSqGSIb3DQEBAQUABIIBAIWjBmx8FqnuuBdGCr7Qjlw1bAhEumm5S4pHwRgfXQKlBS0RESyKCzn2 5d2TMDXk5uLtha0cJudP5bKZsG3S8VnPSP8LyQ3b7fGls5Zhv0JF9/D6oqwfzkyWkh4QR1OX6F+U vlaFCe1GaX/xX1FIgWzjZxFUW/TYuaaKMO2EQf8VDdtPAE5sdP/4hbViab9Qem/o08uNarbzRjDd tRwkDXjUgRI6dHH2UmrWH/6qTo5xleVvbplwiFlYsldZIEaQPpn/RNI7xKw3JcQIBFjgUwd3LR9A LE1n6rlXMtfp5xRNyAotXIRs7GEq7jbdBdskOLjj9+f3CypzCT7TgX9HjZ0AAAAAAAA= --Apple-Mail=_921BE8F8-60F6-4BAE-8960-3903151EFDE8--