From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-wi0-x235.google.com (mail-wi0-x235.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c05::235]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by huchra.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 60F2121F0E8 for ; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 12:05:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by wijq8 with SMTP id q8so95904622wij.0 for ; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 12:05:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Nl8wbVF8dCCNP0VR7jLbihRSHaXnXvxpMk7p+W6Hwus=; b=gIyXviLr6dHSuftzWF2pBB8akeprMJ7o8i+vS0rPJj5MKsAmx5gKhp6fypC0CHf0wj 8p/asZriU9YkKoWl4svFl2ZtZMziVwY+jCKyKZJAJ8z/fiFEZB4APdC5CMc0VDDJotTk mt8urr/KUUDcKqN6a+aTHNGhG/CsXwBsCwZke15kDyUIplSZPhuAeVRuyhXC/3oaboqi C2603Ic2eVlFvHgEkPG2ofNWx0rg4Y5n5yJ9OwddLPjTJzV/ASRw8hs5aT3zBhlT4CSU 1ZGTe8IMwM/K3lYJlDlpOgkxC5FyJAbaeJjM9xjKNi/s2OwxDmxgDRBCGPEn0jwt1dKJ BYPg== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.180.91.12 with SMTP id ca12mr29885087wib.4.1444849501105; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 12:05:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.194.236.234 with HTTP; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 12:05:01 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <7A2801D5E40DD64A85E38DF22117852C8813002D@wdc1exchmbxp05.hq.corp.viasat.com> References: <55AD2695.8050605@kit.edu> <7A2801D5E40DD64A85E38DF22117852C70AE040F@wdc1exchmbxp05.hq.corp.viasat.com> <87a8rlvmxy.fsf@toke.dk> <7A2801D5E40DD64A85E38DF22117852C8812F7E5@wdc1exchmbxp05.hq.corp.viasat.com> <87io69twyi.fsf@toke.dk> <7A2801D5E40DD64A85E38DF22117852C8812FD9E@wdc1exchmbxp05.hq.corp.viasat.com> <703269EE-2B09-4F2B-9462-6CB644371875@toke.dk> <7A2801D5E40DD64A85E38DF22117852C8813002D@wdc1exchmbxp05.hq.corp.viasat.com> Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 21:05:01 +0200 Message-ID: From: Dave Taht To: "Agarwal, Anil" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: =?UTF-8?B?VG9rZSBIw7hpbGFuZC1Kw7hyZ2Vuc2Vu?= , "codel@lists.bufferbloat.net" Subject: Re: [Codel] [aqm] Codel's count variable and re-entering dropping state at small time intervals X-BeenThere: codel@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: CoDel AQM discussions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 19:06:12 -0000 this is not a day to discuss codel. it is a day to fix the internet. http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20151014005564/en/Global-Internet-Exp= erts-Reveal-Plan-Secure-Reliable Please expect any codel related discussion to go by the wayside for a while= . On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 9:01 PM, Agarwal, Anil wr= ote: > Toke, > > Here is the info you requested. > Please let me know if you find any errors. > > For the example in the draft rfc, > based on analytical equations for hash collision probabilities, > the probability of no collision =3D 90.78%, > probability that no more than two of the 100 VoIP sessions will b= e involved in any given collision =3D 99.57%, > probability that no more than three of the 100 VoIP sessions will= be involved in any given collision =3D 99.99%. > > With a 4-way set associative hash table of equivalent size, > the probability of no collision =3D ~100%, > > With an 8-way set associative hash table of equivalent size, > the probability of no collision =3D 99.93%, > > Regards, > Anil > > -----Original Message----- > From: Toke H=C3=B8iland-J=C3=B8rgensen [mailto:toke@toke.dk] > Sent: Wednesday, October 14, 2015 1:58 PM > To: Agarwal, Anil > Subject: RE: [aqm] Codel's count variable and re-entering dropping state = at small time intervals > > Yes, my understanding is #2 (Paul wrote the section originally, will chec= k with him). Wasn't planning to mention set-associative hashes in this draf= t, but we do use it in cake (the "successor"), so would love to see the ana= lysis! > > Incidentally, are you aware of any other fairness queuing systems that us= e set-associative hashes? > > -Toke > > On 14 October 2015 19:23:51 CEST, "Agarwal, Anil" wrote: >>Toke, >> >>Also, do you plan to add some notes on the use of set-associative hash >>tables? >>My analysis also shows collision probabilities for N-way >>set-associative hash tables. >> >>Anil >> >>From: Agarwal, Anil >>Sent: Wednesday, October 14, 2015 1:13 PM >>To: 'Toke H=C3=B8iland-J=C3=B8rgensen' >>Subject: RE: [aqm] Codel's count variable and re-entering dropping >>state at small time intervals >> >> >>Toke, >> >> >> >>I want to make sure I precisely understand the following statement in >>the draft rfc - >> >> >> >>There is about an 86% probability that no more than two of the 100 VoIP >> >>sessions will be involved in any given collision. >> >> >> >>Is it saying that - >> >>1. There is an 86% probability that 98 sessions will be >>collision-free and only 2 sessions will collide. >> >>I think not. >> >>or >> >>2. There is an 86% probability that among the sessions that >>collide, the number of sessions that collide together at a common bin >>value will be 2. >> >>There is a 14% chance that 3 or more sessions will collide into the >>same bin (and hence share the same queue). >> >>or >> >>3. Something else >> >> >> >>I assume it is #2. >> >>Please confirm and then I will send you the analysis. >> >> >> >>Thanks, >> >>Anil >> >> >> >> >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Toke H=C3=B8iland-J=C3=B8rgensen [mailto:toke@toke.dk] >>Sent: Wednesday, October 14, 2015 9:13 AM >>To: Agarwal, Anil >>Subject: Re: [aqm] Codel's count variable and re-entering dropping >>state at small time intervals >> >> >> >>"Agarwal, Anil" >>> writes: >> >> >> >>> I will clean up the equations and send you the doc in a few hours. >> >> >> >>Cool, thanks! >> >> >> >>> Are in the process of revising draft-ietf-aqm-fq-codel-01? It's >> >>> expiration date is shown as January 5, 2016. But I suppose it is >> >>> useful to post the next update earlier than that. >> >> >> >>Yeah, figured I'd do another revision before the next meeting, even if >>the AQM group is not scheduled. Current draft here: >> >>https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__kau.toke.dk_ietf_d >>raft-2Dietf-2Daqm-2Dfq-2Dcodel-2D02.html&d=3DBQIBAg&c=3Djcv3orpCsv7C4ly8-= ub >>Dob57ycZ4jvhoYZNDBA06fPk&r=3DFyvaklKYrHaSCPjbBTdviWIW9uSbnxdNSheSGz1Jvq4& >>m=3D2GbxJwOxywTH1qXvOYaEDXpi8xnj4PMSw3vn7aDEszU&s=3DSj61jStdaiIE503n8_vQ9= Bf >>k-F9uk_hdcDi9x47m66U&e=3D >> >> >> >>-Toke --=20 Dave T=C3=A4ht Do you want faster, better, wifi? https://www.patreon.com/dtaht