From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-lj1-x233.google.com (mail-lj1-x233.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7328C3CB39 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2019 22:09:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-lj1-x233.google.com with SMTP id v22so12988275lje.9 for ; Mon, 08 Apr 2019 19:09:32 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=UPU85uFCiWhxirQ2yl4ZfcAqtUtcNsCOd77ZDgq4pj8=; b=Koe8qIaRd8CP7BHvReYfx++jY4VHkRma0Q1yePDuzL79rcaLcQjigW7+bU+e2bfLgZ lqDnHAAqAJd2ePLM6aHO/qukWl20BNoDe0UJ+W44UAIDfiVNscXTuDq/l/VMEp8n2BpU hq8MjV75MhD7ilRlMMga7W9+Jb9hpXc+Gh68MkjpOw8SfqGQYRzHdIgLAf8BmhpFXNjq rs8ON0zunTk/cNxFJjNzAXDzVhT+g0OE++zUWWSRj0X2JsJqmaryvNuwEPwhJVTN47SA y+D3Ik0yLu6GKLDhLqGKz5aTRTlsaZKsxiaW/3F/0f0uz7rNTyMglxq5pWeSWbxgG6Qo FQxA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=UPU85uFCiWhxirQ2yl4ZfcAqtUtcNsCOd77ZDgq4pj8=; b=Kp8BkKQ3eFjPCwr5eTnfrtYWQTrBTJxka4vX/E/1bLu3cRa2z+p7r6ugOvjLK385Lg KmP0XYobdr//vzuG6F0QPHQQ5boVevG0yJZJgIh4/OAw0HsISDnNKjfTcp1rpl103toP Dce9w3tb+3A1AOVxCbP9kJcStIe9oCtwCi1rTuaXWHKqlHSpUywhlF/SXs9NhISGXbUN 3zZJ0F/Gv8ahg7AjOAbzWvJekf7I2fXpS5+wBZ5wn2ntf/GNOeFN3qfU2kyyCLIikmSl g5hGSG7bpS4XTEhYyWO6cUwfIyTXMZyxj+wpsl58F8rbRgebKUrP/l6KDY6LLzFbGxgl rWhQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAU7MbcW8PnBh3J0ltzS5ki+wz7veN59GBNoXrslLRki11Od3PSd rS+tbpit04tA56lk7gPceLo= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqy1COuq+GyF9kC1eRiqRj3D1dwc6HrB28CQMEloXQYe6j9bTjCJ/Il02IGicdvwnsELOqU+mg== X-Received: by 2002:a2e:12c4:: with SMTP id 65mr17384949ljs.141.1554775771208; Mon, 08 Apr 2019 19:09:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jonathartonsmbp.lan (83-245-225-56-nat-p.elisa-mobile.fi. [83.245.225.56]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id s16sm5277007lji.61.2019.04.08.19.09.30 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 08 Apr 2019 19:09:30 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\)) From: Jonathan Morton In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 9 Apr 2019 05:09:29 +0300 Cc: Sebastian Moeller , flent-users , BBR Development , ECN-Sane Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <08179F6A-A432-4465-BF70-BE8D727436C8@gmail.com> References: <3EDC8EAC-1EB2-4E64-8973-8AE177D8789C@gmail.com> To: Neal Cardwell X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1) Subject: Re: [Ecn-sane] [Flent-users] [bbr-dev] duplicating the BBRv2 tests at iccrg in flent? X-BeenThere: ecn-sane@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion of explicit congestion notification's impact on the Internet List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Apr 2019 02:09:32 -0000 > I wonder if one is willing to change ECN semantics already, by making = CELighter weight than a packetdrop, why not also using an explicit = signal for emergency brake? This is the principle I proposed with SCE. There, CE remains a broadly = drop-equivalent signal (the "emergency brake"), while ECT(1) becomes = SCE, a softer and higher-precision signal which is produced in the way = DCTCP expects. As of a couple of hours ago, I have three machines in my bedroom which = are running SCE-aware Linux kernels, including a "rehabilitated" version = of DCTCP which responds appropriately to drops, CE and SCE and is = therefore compatible with use on the general Internet. Now I just need to blow the cobwebs off the test harnesses which were = used to refine Cake, to ensure that the assertion I just made above is = actually true. - Jonathan Morton=