From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from wizmail.org (wizmail.org [IPv6:2a00:1940:107::2:0:0]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3A8A53B2A4 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2019 08:39:29 -0400 (EDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; cv=none; a=rsa-sha256; d=wizmail.org; s=r201803; t=1553517569; b=G1+yoot8H4WG+HcNdZ/BbFUZgxdjV0wSLPr1TsWihj1W70VIOw50+m7fNG6CKLHaVS3OiGLi6d gqoCO9+9BVZV2dZkHFPE9yF/zKh7QPqr+HG+T5FBw8DkVZz7j/BeOhbqGaHuPoIcEeNedTrXmw glZkJqMv46Bq1WMU4yIPxck=; ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; wizmail.org; iprev=fail smtp.remote-ip=2a00:b900:109e:0:855c:1404:1b9d:3a94; auth=pass (PLAIN) smtp.auth=jgh@wizmail.org ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed; d=wizmail.org; s=r201803; t=1553517569; bh=aaijL3Gy/6tMOTSkQTmsNfwnaHqxda+tPcmMmxdvLWY=; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Date: Message-ID:From:References:To:Subject:DKIM-Signature; b=pMvorMeP+YkbqHQd0PpLuwUDmzPWVA6qeNb62/H03JpRus+CJcQxrQYejbYs57p+mZRyXjHynl jteKnkj+6HGgTsk9+XTtPlfijAlZL5B1Go0wBglr1GhCtDQb/ywsLCiEUr8IkUww6dCQtybIwC 8dR641C6/oaDZd28Z+QyUgM=; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=wizmail.org ; s=r201803; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:In-Reply-To: MIME-Version:Date:Message-ID:From:References:To:Subject:From:Sender:Reply-To: Subject:Date:Message-ID:To:Cc:MIME-Version:Content-Type: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date: Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To: References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe:List-Post: List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=3q/PEUx6ZGxwhKyXjIzLtu27dnbN8Ixgeid35qYngbQ=; b=0 F6WKEram9YIp/joe8UESVqllCRJ2Nqe1xqWnW7OSproOivsY/awFodtXsHp+uKos6KVvkf1VvZ1sW FnjYA47H0BSrOWQnC9A+Xc/OOUaOTWDxd7hmSrVeIF4l6zJpBVSHn42oGRq61A6Q/fxVxsAKz+Hbz Dezqawv+F/BgHGVE=; Authentication-Results: wizmail.org; iprev=fail smtp.remote-ip=2a00:b900:109e:0:855c:1404:1b9d:3a94; auth=pass (PLAIN) smtp.auth=jgh@wizmail.org Received: from [2a00:b900:109e:0:855c:1404:1b9d:3a94] (helo=lap.dom.ain) by wizmail.org (Exim 4.92.105) (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) with esmtpsa id 1h8Osx-0005bf-OZ for ecn-sane@lists.bufferbloat.net (return-path ); Mon, 25 Mar 2019 12:39:27 +0000 To: ecn-sane@lists.bufferbloat.net References: From: Jeremy Harris Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=jgh@wizmail.org; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQENBFWABsQBCADTFfb9EHGGiDel/iFzU0ag1RuoHfL/09z1y7iQlLynOAQTRRNwCWezmqpD p6zDFOf1Ldp0EdEQtUXva5g2lm3o56o+mnXrEQr11uZIcsfGIck7yV/y/17I7ApgXMPg/mcj ifOTM9C7+Ptghf3jUhj4ErYMFQLelBGEZZifnnAoHLOEAH70DENCI08PfYRRG6lZDB09nPW7 vVG8RbRUWjQyxQUWwXuq4gQohSFDqF4NE8zDHE/DgPJ/yFy+wFr2ab90DsE7vOYb42y95keK tTBp98/Y7/2xbzi8EYrXC+291dwZELMHnYLF5sO/fDcrDdwrde2cbZ+wtpJwtSYPNvVxABEB AAG0JkplcmVteSBIYXJyaXMgKG5vbmUpIDxqZ2hAd2l6bWFpbC5vcmc+iQE7BBMBAgAlAhsD BgsJCAcDAgYVCAIJCgsEFgIDAQIeAQIXgAUCVYAYBAIZAQAKCRC85YyM5B8y34iFB/9wozIY RogNdY1aejFFixb6++y4b1riyjMvWEULeEzDlQ0lMT6Z3PxXhZILD4y4aP7Kzx0ozXa5qaKy 41EAPKQoPipnRAH04QytJbIERvz8Tot/LeCVKUc0G9DVxOPBD03czTgqgz4EjV2qvnLF+rTU 0YBevrNCluKosGSd+3RvLWVu0hBhn9pELKfXJNSQXZb+TpHDhSDZ/gCrglBEOhA6YWbDb/4g z+5TFKdk+B++iAQZSHv7zISabjN+BPYgI47A+MU4JycoXaAUnMc0l5ba6fGNaIrzruE4aAZr lP5o+7mlU9Mm0QJqdqYxYPAiplJGrZv+YXH1fp5ueEK3l+NGuQENBFWABsQBCADphLHaKToR uR/E7THerBiCjDatwCaETOKOTY2zRBQpaQ32p/F2XIGLS8Cc27+grZSKQ6ZX0ZN47O+AFyFH F8DH90IXZFpJR3Rb8zgXT8jnLX08DM31eECZHnRzFhGlOmq6WAUlqB3GKCPUCY2c4eTRXyoX LteTxrXCYoj45y/YmvlZrlonBNjPBAyHiO/LNz+V7fZtNsN7N/XGrnLbcdNfNd+SD1ENmbLJ 8RvyymxguTyB/ka9JdjHHIoQEJ6L166B3hhfCHpt8iC0GPZkti9IMl0NoJ029jJm3Jq1qEce EBn5H5QMGn6Fq64iXwTsO1TMNUwpWx8pjvV7wVIxjI8ZABEBAAGJAR8EGAECAAkFAlWABsQC GwwACgkQvOWMjOQfMt9N6Af8CS2CTrMQFdhkGEtBXmL4ifD8UHFkBRBGmM8ZL2fWUBTZXT8m rdRMOK6tcPnKWaCvWvKr0knt970j/DyAgFmH8hgOi3yctigFecVDjjilAeCJMq38s1tYKYiL DbBdHWtdkA9uHZwq3lfd3QxcEEO3QamQF+dO7h8gAOXlG+po87Hm+E0wz4swIB8+S37Jzrx9 uu0LSFDfJCTK+TIKGa5Un8LxPxyq9WnnNDh72zK7BiRidk/s40KcNod83NM4Hn/sbGfyLa8s S0F3ME0S+ocSMOiu/ZHHOiwpLYNbwTJ7stZxGsrguWeT9P+amxbA/YlK95LedstwvN+WcHZ7 d++Arg== Message-ID: <4d578f92-8a3f-5efa-fa9c-bd917770d3c4@wizmail.org> Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2019 12:39:24 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Language: en-GB Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Pcms-Received-Sender: [2a00:b900:109e:0:855c:1404:1b9d:3a94] (helo=lap.dom.ain) with esmtpsa Subject: Re: [Ecn-sane] draft tsvwg slides #1 X-BeenThere: ecn-sane@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion of explicit congestion notification's impact on the Internet List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2019 12:39:29 -0000 On 25/03/2019 12:27, Rich Brown wrote: > 3: The Problem - good. Maybe say that *loss* only provides binary signal per RTT -> Oscillation -> Bang-bang control theory Why can't you divide amount-of-missing by (RTT * goodput), for a proportional signal? Only one sample of signal per RTT, but better than binary. -- Cheers, Jeremy