From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.15.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 533733B29D; Sat, 16 Oct 2021 08:49:07 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1634388545; bh=ex8w6QalPUoCnQNgQr23z+86TFaa+z1OMmJCExzbxj4=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:References:To; b=HP6aXsZkrJwZrTibP/QswGZO1+iJ7DwCl0E4qZJcssnIomx7vTdTFmAXzx9u01R4G a3UgSwp81BM2kHJNz049oE4eVarWnnBb304OLndSiNgl4CihloRtGJ9hC21I7JtVvA TlFj09dzRrXc0/X7RZMO6zb+GJg/3ZfpDXq31m1g= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [192.168.42.229] ([95.116.180.43]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx005 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MBDnI-1mRJ0R0hV0-00CmAr; Sat, 16 Oct 2021 14:49:05 +0200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.7\)) From: Sebastian Moeller In-Reply-To: Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2021 14:49:04 +0200 Cc: =?utf-8?Q?Dave_T=C3=A4ht?= , Cake List , ECN-Sane Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <63AB0168-990A-4384-BDA8-C4E20D615123@gmx.de> References: <87sfx31dt5.fsf@toke.dk> <87pms71cmr.fsf@toke.dk> <95231AF9-DCCA-4D41-9BF4-8F55307F45F6@gmail.com> <1F8C74DF-1384-4F72-904A-8293369DE95D@gmx.de> To: Jonathan Morton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.7) X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:GaIrjGAQ3pXFJDGMS+TCfx3SB4vtrlwLlfwDF9+/uCnIZTiPavK TC5APioz+HX/PTDZTZrRu9TmejOnCrdOOUaIT4fk/QQDrR2NlJQAL0+cjCN/tRW26dUr5e6 m2udGjxIEredKaUfcc3GNURFIwn842oE5J+zh0Ejr/wRQLIW6c0x/bglmg7z34hESFCOpak bmvdiCbY/LMp40S3LvFFA== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:VytA8mSaPr4=:+8+hmJmGyPxDd9WVEHIZpv tQNYDf7vX1BgKgQ2A+MbNh0sDiTFfRKY9c1isgKYf6HSGyNUdcP7x+XvVbQuHDl2Wq+yPhNAd nJrrapF32dHtPOIKdkRou9a5rpLypn7G4bllsDnCyjH9JT/1ZNBL1tX5EJ3ZsX3M+BlfNixqg QDcUe/+OJAOjPxgEfefBpYYyljbt73ViScXbVTRBZkjGVZLcnKdZ7onpz8cfMU1maZMmDm6VU bVeQTMyJOT03PuuR9rzZOQWZT8RTOKR2UTl2MlyAq0TvZDNsOMOE4FOxLVdYThds6FDFyBbJA Qs9o5fdFM+C8/FVx1gIkel6XM4e63hSc59G37qjNiMX0mJHmOaHy3007f0LehmQfsgJpBq2N+ fQgMX/MkRrS+zYaoDsfkpOXJfUkOEwPhCtRRsCU4vZJgfXHaT6jkHtzc7VEOLgVbS84QU57XE DIVKb+4CQBEr0FG/RHb8rWaxRPi4zvj1WIIEXjOOYdJVdS1SdxJegOhSRtO1NXOzx5QOl5va5 CVOStjAjal4XsQcJarKZXCeYIYZhl/IHdalj4+ky1UbVmFjyx14ArsIEoLepj/u1wugT5wKWw O+ydTClUUa++P5Txu0eUGpaCkZAR1uNJYYV7ZseQkiANwjhziWvoMNopKqujw2lsZEdoszJyz k33HoFmWZUe1CUTiSO5CSuvuCfOq/D+8fnxc3kRepac7x4ya8MVSPWFIpFoGY+Wh6T91sLZfK td/ioskP6rFb0dYpeQLa2+D52KGZeE7DYxTh2pFl0zttN4BZzJW9DE/Z6jUK7dsqNzmjdKJRM TpVkXL7TOYMQV4z+XqH6+hEimiCGQ0L1L9H5aGXqm1wakGadUR4pCVZld8MwcetSl57XghCDU esDfjb0NLUmNjt4QaoN5GtyD+Mbirx2bh9qasU3WjtMvODcFieFNd86Q4Mok2gZHaMhc6YKOD Nk5ghsIE3SP3SK87P8WsCSof2ruy/mI7QeZ0pkdXvAT2b961o9mkIvqtHStCcTADukQkp5Z+n DsrXKy/ksYqA6dphiB2LL5n+Cblfezs4x2PRGLmUIFz0Oi1hzsooBTWD/8IUqGTYQ/LACV43H lhghh+kaO1zJVY= Subject: Re: [Ecn-sane] [Cake] l4s kernel submission X-BeenThere: ecn-sane@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion of explicit congestion notification's impact on the Internet List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2021 12:49:07 -0000 Hi Jonathan, > On Oct 16, 2021, at 10:54, Jonathan Morton = wrote: >=20 >> On 16 Oct, 2021, at 11:38 am, Sebastian Moeller = wrote: >>=20 >> I also think that some one subscribed should weight in on the exempt = one packet from marking, especially in the light of GRO/GSO. >=20 > I do have some experience with this from Cake, but Cake has the = distinct benefit of (usually) knowing what the dequeue rate is, without = having to estimate it. Without that knowledge, I'm not sure it's = profitable to guess - except to specifically avoid tail *loss*, which is = not at all the same as *marking* the last packet. Thinking it over, Bob's recommended special casing one packet = will be essentially equivalent to increasing the marking target, except = for the case of small packets, where you might see/desire marking before = the equivalent sojourn time of a full MTU packet is accumulated. My = hunch is that is really rare, and the whole exercise will just lead to = artificially and non-functionally low marking threshold... =20 Regards Sebastian >=20 > - Jonathan Morton