From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-io1-xd2b.google.com (mail-io1-xd2b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4C1213CB35 for ; Tue, 27 Aug 2019 14:20:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-io1-xd2b.google.com with SMTP id 18so324242ioe.10 for ; Tue, 27 Aug 2019 11:20:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Z4g0/AyDkqVaW0rt0JPZKh9p7UA+9hNEoBxajTKarHI=; b=PYeybk1007BpQg93U6pn1R7B8Q3qFexrmuRbOP+tKxH82CPOaRRKwOw3KrCJ6bQaME xYZz75XNItspVWwcc1k6O5Ynr/GC/Kj/fqRv1qCQSA1MkgAUu6qgC7aTcKqnOh68by8f Ic1Rbev+sj0ZerTQk/VHM2sPake4ZAhj3OV0tA+kzaPpe0l4r66EX8ZTAaXpgi+jpKIL FNcehvZm9vpm4dlzWoZOGTtvH43hMutZS+vWIuhnEzWZWZxOmLdW1/lfBszmqHPcjvg8 goimj3VfgNdcYkpTA84xfscedBId3Peyz9pcBkEF+69ebXmURd+nV5kQlhxo0/DD0RwH qr+w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Z4g0/AyDkqVaW0rt0JPZKh9p7UA+9hNEoBxajTKarHI=; b=EkZHoNxnTb7bg8ynpj4xjzqLKSPDZN/uo1YICvWg0KEMCn/42HYQFxUoe1Z/9LE+oA 6PvcZQhTtr/xQ3LIP9SorCbBZH9FrEWDpE4Ls12tTt0dvQUe2pTLPbSbktA1DD8s1cuL XFo8QEedw4Ky/4SHK42TlR9k9xvZ6kRJqLJlZu6LtGtyoPehxLm0ltzxEQfyopfVknqZ Zxlo2Nqb6aL5mu4IRJf36jhv7YblVNRzY5nb7gML7cNY/2lMb3zh6ZjYnhaFi8Ex/CSf TNFqs0nInJeSX6hZUO+zzUTdGr25lc0HfP49y7vl80HuO004Ao4nBlH1F9ss7BBzus0G X72A== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAW+AKU1RJ8STOOLPbfxavJN5jJ0pKj5XnYvdEFbSlzIIfBSALnF /0Ywc2UnhuhwdDttkNKrcwtcif1oGjJ91BgC/8Y= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyrZhbkFp7tx2Yqdyz81KnukEkAhp3cwOK+11Bjhm5NilfI+lgGBxFO/FVPEZmI/EhiXRNbwlAf+w6X0R0u8vA= X-Received: by 2002:a6b:8dd6:: with SMTP id p205mr4286380iod.150.1566930022688; Tue, 27 Aug 2019 11:20:22 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <4471314E-BACE-4EEA-B954-9795833764E3@ifi.uio.no> In-Reply-To: From: Dave Taht Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2019 11:20:11 -0700 Message-ID: To: Mikael Abrahamsson Cc: Michael Welzl , ECN-Sane Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [Ecn-sane] osx ecn X-BeenThere: ecn-sane@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion of explicit congestion notification's impact on the Internet List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2019 18:20:23 -0000 An interesing piece of this is how often the syn attempt is failing. 2192 times graceful fallback to Non-ECN connection 2053 times lost ECN negotiating SYN, followed by retransmis= sion ?? Now, there are plenty of reasons to lose syns (most firewalls rate limit th= ese), besides the ecn flag. In my case during this boot cycle I've been engaged in a fun experiment - and one day perhaps a paper - Going to various coffee shops in the area and running the attached script. The results thus far are universally dismal, except for google starbucks which is excellent - but the packet captures seem to indicate something in addition to or other than than fq_codel in use (dpi maybe? aruba is the next hop) AND it did not negotiate ecn when I last tried. Wifi spread initially through the coffee shop phenomenon, and I've "lept over the counter" a couple times to help configure the to-the-isp qos system when I found an owner with clue, which helps a lot. When I showed 'em the before/after two bought me lunch (and I can highly recommend https://www.cemitas1.com/ in davenport for food, music, view & wifi) if that's a motivator for more folk here "to get out more", please do so. Table service is a nice thing to have when in deep hack mode and socializing more helps too. : daves-Air-6:los_gatos_starbucks d$ more testit.sh #!/bin/sh T=3D"Los_Gatos_Starbucks" F=3D"flent -x -H flent-fremont.bufferbloat.net -t $T" # pick a closer flent server and on linux use --socket-stats $F --te=3Ddownload_streams=3D4 tcp_ndown $F --te=3Dupload_streams=3D4 tcp_nup $F --te=3Dupload_streams=3D4 tcp_2up_square $F rrul $F rrul_be On Tue, Aug 27, 2019 at 12:02 AM Mikael Abrahamsson wrot= e: > > On Tue, 27 Aug 2019, Michael Welzl wrote: > > > run it as root - strange, yes, but then the output is very different. > > Thanks, indeed. > > $ sudo netstat -sp tcp | egrep 'CE|EC' > 11097 client connections attempted to negotiate ECN > 4864 client connections successfully negotiated ECN > 3800 times graceful fallback to Non-ECN connection > 467 times lost ECN negotiating SYN, followed by retransmi= ssion > 52 server connections attempted to negotiate ECN > 52 server connections successfully negotiated ECN > 0 time lost ECN negotiating SYN-ACK, followed by retransm= ission > 427 times received congestion experienced (CE) notificati= on > 0 time CWR was sent in response to ECE > 6111 times sent ECE notification > 15 connections received CE atleast once > 0 connection received ECE atleast once > 267 connections using ECN have seen packet loss but no CE > 1 connection using ECN have seen packet loss and CE > 14 connections using ECN received CE but no packet loss > 14 connections fell back to non-ECN due to SYN-loss > 1 connection fell back to non-ECN due to reordering > 0 connection fell back to non-ECN due to excessive CE-mar= kings > > > -- > Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se --=20 Dave T=C3=A4ht CTO, TekLibre, LLC http://www.teklibre.com Tel: 1-831-205-9740