From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-oi1-x236.google.com (mail-oi1-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9AB2E3CB37; Sun, 24 Mar 2019 05:30:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-oi1-x236.google.com with SMTP id w137so4798583oiw.5; Sun, 24 Mar 2019 02:30:20 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=li7s9JPAdEyPuhlnfAeBg43sce2AY73hSjGTzaFwd/8=; b=ZMUUppPgXRkhcECvq/HPztI2KaFmpV/RcCaRJOOtncVH1ZsD/tFg9cujjAAAjA0oe4 tKee+b7AX2nxCOgA+5Om42tWzcrOYx2UxIOd4EQ2nCie+jZOTUzKlkX97YYy8FoR8Z6w cOZKMS6IeSnCTKRN3EVojLMvE0QuwYKSQTUJjsz/Nkcb9aYlmiPozQY8nBHKpwUhndeD GYWDD3tIma3gHpN7m/jWOierGaGZFqKtNi7me/zu0/f8OBJS2gne1yxfyrq5sL4i+Pt8 IbJw/IAfQKybRDUGzxcZr5YTrWcVJUUbbymdORds11obLyk5RVomQSPDw+llZ378LF8G Ly6Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=li7s9JPAdEyPuhlnfAeBg43sce2AY73hSjGTzaFwd/8=; b=KAjaBPYcjajzU8d5N8eBel9Q5bwnCdc9muTDA0FU3RP0+8JCpAjkj/y4XBbqPNFO+c +vA84jZGlLx6wAoCZNtkHVZSX0bxDXbWH4Wf2dnIDGQ8VwunYKz8ejqFMNtNsgVnpr7D 7ff6QFShPBJ3OZJk/32SgKLfZCXLSs1RSe/04oLSpinrSlXyE1ulBUvTVYlYuj+ZMp7X yvu8EBbhGtYHpGwpP+o41Fheh9YuJ0aDdSWM5Q+YRGmjJa09vt4+os0799TyqE4dLTWV Syf0Z55T3XQfT9Yp9bploKAuivtpokqQWe6UqzcdvY06hpfYDFUisNeQ9CgAQoaF2AE6 NgPQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXg3XpUPtyUKiJQTdN96gbfeDEVXB9CVMmIES0+0bQ19yoAgPUQ JIZLtGBShJYJTX0VAS4JHzcMoilbYxOoSj3Vfx0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqykeDALxKS7OEr3K5NUuQzJKLtzilblk6iKBFXkkfvzDFQlcP9le97mD0SJn98LZkqoAnX63tBDQGxNXgGBV3I= X-Received: by 2002:aca:c3cc:: with SMTP id t195mr7469448oif.151.1553419819865; Sun, 24 Mar 2019 02:30:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <3F3F78F9-8F97-42F2-9005-F8449489BECF@gmail.com> <42B7B2FB-94FC-4CA6-B75E-CADB61FE3173@gmail.com> <6047E899-078F-4E08-A29C-B87D268A4E5E@heistp.net> <69EA569B-4AD2-4C4B-937B-9ABDD563B120@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: From: Luca Muscariello Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2019 10:30:08 +0100 Message-ID: To: Dave Taht Cc: Jonathan Morton , ecn-sane@lists.bufferbloat.net, Cake List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000008cdb1a0584d3bc14" Subject: Re: [Ecn-sane] [Cake] The two SCE tests I have in mind X-BeenThere: ecn-sane@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion of explicit congestion notification's impact on the Internet List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2019 09:30:20 -0000 --0000000000008cdb1a0584d3bc14 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable We have done something like that a year ago in our team in Cisco for a project that you Dave are aware of but that is out of scope for these lists. It is important to have vantage points in residential and enterprise networks. Cloud to Cloud never goes to transit and the big Clouds have global footprints. So you can traverse the planet inside the Cloud WAN (100% bit consistency) and then traverse a safe peering point where the adjacency has been well set (or not). IPv4/IPv6 of course we'll see a big difference in favour of IPv6. What Michael has shown is his paper makes a lot of sense to me. Depending on the use case hit ratio can be very high or very low. On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 9:55 AM Dave Taht wrote: > 1) The research into whether bit flipping to the extent that SCE will > do has not been done yet. The study of ECT(0) vs ECT(1) behavior > transiting to CE was a little lightweight. > > To test this we going to fire up a ton of nanodes in various data > centers, with low SCE thresholds, and low bandwidths, to flip lots of > bits, and test between the data centers and from as many vantage > points around the net as we can get - do packet captures as well as > flent tests > > as a control, set up identical boxes, with SCE disabled, in the same > data centers. > > Setup flent, irtt, iperf3. > > 2) Diffserv bit preservation test > > The research going by on the tsvwg mailing seems a bit dated. It is > very straightforward to use irtt to test to see what udp codepoints > survive e2e, and to also leverage this testbed setup. Similarly, > netperf can easily be used to mark tcp. We do not have a good packet > cap tool to verify that the bits are being set right, however I think > irtt can be modified to check for correctness here and produce a > report. > > On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 1:45 AM Jonathan Morton > wrote: > > > > > On 24 Mar, 2019, at 8:37 am, Pete Heist wrote: > > > > > > I should theoretically arrive at the boat today some time after 3pm, > having picked up a mini HDMI to HDMI adapter, which we can use with the > cable that=E2=80=99s there=E2=80=A6 > > > > Awesome. I'm also setting up a Linux VM on my Mac, which should help > things along. > > > > We're bringing up some actual hardware with the SCE-enabled Cake on it > now. Dave wants to investigate various theoretical phenomena the Interne= t > might exhibit with a mixture of ECN codepoints; I just want to be sure it > actually works as intended, before I move on to fiddling with TCP. > > > > - Jonathan Morton > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Cake mailing list > > Cake@lists.bufferbloat.net > > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/cake > > > > -- > > Dave T=C3=A4ht > CTO, TekLibre, LLC > http://www.teklibre.com > Tel: 1-831-205-9740 > _______________________________________________ > Cake mailing list > Cake@lists.bufferbloat.net > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/cake > --0000000000008cdb1a0584d3bc14 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
We have done something like that a year ago in our team in= Cisco
for a project that you Dave are aware of but that is out of scop= e for these lists.

It is important to have vantage= points in residential and enterprise networks.=C2=A0
Cloud to Cl= oud never goes to transit and the big Clouds have global footprints.
<= div>So you can traverse the planet inside the Cloud WAN (100% bit consisten= cy) and then traverse a safe peering=C2=A0
point where the adjace= ncy=C2=A0 has been well set (or not).

IPv4/IPv6 of= course we'll see a big difference in favour of IPv6.=C2=A0
W= hat Michael has shown is his paper makes a lot of sense to me.
De= pending on the use case hit ratio can be very high or very low.
<= br>



On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 9:55 AM Dave= Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com>= ; wrote:
1) The = research into whether bit flipping to the extent that SCE will
do has not been done yet. The study of ECT(0) vs ECT(1) behavior
transiting to CE was a little lightweight.

To test this we going to fire up a ton of nanodes in various data
centers, with low SCE thresholds, and low bandwidths, to flip lots of
bits, and test between the data centers and from as many vantage
points around the net as we can get - do packet captures as well as
flent tests

as a control, set up identical boxes, with SCE disabled, in the same
data centers.

Setup flent, irtt, iperf3.

2) Diffserv bit preservation test

The research going by on the tsvwg mailing seems a bit dated. It is
very straightforward to use irtt to test to see what udp codepoints
survive e2e, and to also leverage this testbed setup. Similarly,
netperf can easily be used to mark tcp. We do not have a good packet
cap tool to verify that the bits are being set right, however I think
irtt can be modified to check for correctness here and produce a
report.

On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 1:45 AM Jonathan Morton <chromatix99@gmail.com> wrote: >
> > On 24 Mar, 2019, at 8:37 am, Pete Heist <pete@heistp.net> wrote:
> >
> > I should theoretically arrive at the boat today some time after 3= pm, having picked up a mini HDMI to HDMI adapter, which we can use with the= cable that=E2=80=99s there=E2=80=A6
>
> Awesome.=C2=A0 I'm also setting up a Linux VM on my Mac, which sho= uld help things along.
>
> We're bringing up some actual hardware with the SCE-enabled Cake o= n it now.=C2=A0 Dave wants to investigate various theoretical phenomena the= Internet might exhibit with a mixture of ECN codepoints; I just want to be= sure it actually works as intended, before I move on to fiddling with TCP.=
>
>=C2=A0 - Jonathan Morton
>
> _______________________________________________
> Cake mailing list
> Cake@l= ists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/cake



--

Dave T=C3=A4ht
CTO, TekLibre, LLC
ht= tp://www.teklibre.com
Tel: 1-831-205-9740
_______________________________________________
Cake mailing list
Cake@lists.= bufferbloat.net
https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/cake
--0000000000008cdb1a0584d3bc14--