From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.20]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AC01D3B2A4; Wed, 7 Dec 2022 02:50:26 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.de; s=s31663417; t=1670399417; bh=QGPL8POGSVGWYCTfd8fqi/Ja99j8O85diUeW25kZOIs=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Date:From:To:CC:Subject:In-Reply-To:References; b=uGCSgfslhbR2ncRt4+u8viFWRqjmGz0JCblmBOt08tP9tJ61lOwruoMuPAKra8qAZ fcMSkn4/ytnOTeoeydTFJe3BNYzDhvaTHqXwEwCLQZWS9fAhdQyzBNT3dqAImo70m0 PVNZUg6oPGwi+BRXr6nAIrN3isjTvevrDz8rCDTbGxPhy0Dw6WDpfa4TvsrGyTprIN BdJyo2UPUOctXRi/sfLlq2xOiYXJTvZ57GlLjXPoyrr5MjoovhUB3l9smCnZMhU5d8 imH2lL5mYocrj8JlAj6mLCDTCAnVQY9UuJKZ5qqDINkeYqFhl4VGDetGJAqLd2HTGo 9yYpNdS2+gyPg== X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a Received: from [127.0.0.1] ([134.76.241.253]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx104 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1N3se8-1ou7zs2tbU-00zjpc; Wed, 07 Dec 2022 08:50:16 +0100 Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2022 08:50:13 +0100 From: Sebastian Moeller To: rjmcmahon , rjmcmahon via Make-wifi-fast , Dave Taht CC: Rpm , Make-Wifi-fast , libreqos , Dave Taht via Starlink , bloat User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <566AC2D7-FB33-4924-9B21-BE9A8476E0B3@gmx.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=----DFQ0Z0J3RKNYLPB1XYNUJCB3ATYNC8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:/p9NygyfubqMtSBTh1vNeiKCZv7FKKJ7nU6taxWu/VQjX5g5j11 YjRljyYvQvqIAejepWkfd8G8eDPumfymshvJQLghK/XSRLYUql8RDqs2WLOsr7IngI/cRFl f0Xj0n0UkcVyePTy7uyuUGAPx40Up7UsljIKldcKjsH4UjgeK7YE3cKEURiMVkhT7IUeDPt I7g95F6wT2DDlt5mVV/TQ== X-Spam-Flag: NO UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:j+SVyf8UNOM=;B/26l5VLSQ9wkzkPr6bCZYPT2jA 5Mv2eABd66JpTb+UJP0BBrsS7wpPQx28+zQVdXNbm2SzaGZlMRJLkRotRVBA32da3gMEginHo DuegFjJJNKX/rCEmiGWe5iaI4VcsmLEM812HucojdSTL0U7jVfg1MgJC3hjEvWoRA+8FPEmAK FvOejAbEW/qe2IpVMJe+P2k9qKzMCA7ra4vq/5swfsZh5TnmTxJjqyFmFJQTDJXTY+0w4icPS 3JfZl+yIh5KmI5Nv/UdtcefmDoImdXTvLsoqGRuTO7bFu2NR9xRva8oufo/ZoLN1DOupSrejD hfSj1hd2TuBhaliCn7fpR+UOMxmzjaaipnNenTTKmLcbLQ0DEaUEM1baD4tAvCyxHMk45zu5m BuiXu5Eq+OnQHUB9xwT8NNH06f/O8Licr6r0+LnY4zS1na0pFC7CVdhwvy93OwP6bFABPn2Ry s+976FmmqMxGQbAkt8Vt7U0yGg5fpzEPSi/aLAvOv5kT7xhdrXEMIdTR1FaLosqcppexF3M2H YzUrMugZx3hjyIxQM4P2zG52vOh4bKUV9xNJ9Lm8JttIHFCh3fd5VZQhHoMWr1xnQET4ExJeP 6DD43WNHr2DW6GIfUDCI00jfupq1KgUF6gSTW4pZpGIvTZRLb7p1+obWQQJCbccDSIh+6byBc vvRSure2+BNljLFoY4MOaf2mhk3Rer0NgiTx9aH2YsON4AQPPG8sDFEoDZ8Yt3Uq/ZMAiA5sw CYe7B4eUiB5Vp8lS/xJ7GpqMKEnq/fvcHQgdSZtG0M6bd8bwHPxoreMAwi6O2vKFM+HdblP35 CeUMbfwQ+tiS89yZr0gbNOdNtPb09RGxcbhEtcXLhE7QaX+Df/7Kkg9XtBStpFy9R698k1dnE L+N/37ExGDnGKNJiQBwgLUbRhZIkju8fq+sbv6MrXdQHJMB7Uc+x1ugf13707vX0XsY4U14qO dcTAm47vjPyOMijww6N6in3K0dDcbd7zf+Hgrjc6ThkqxHrL+Epy86qi+pk2hYqdsh7RVA== Subject: Re: [LibreQoS] [Make-wifi-fast] [Rpm] make-wifi-fast 2016 & crusader X-BeenThere: libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Many ISPs need the kinds of quality shaping cake can do List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2022 07:50:27 -0000 ------DFQ0Z0J3RKNYLPB1XYNUJCB3ATYNC8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Bob, What simple end users would need is (semi-)public iperf2 servers accessibl= e over the internet to be comparably easy to use as iperf3=2E=2E=2E=2E Regards Sebastian On 6 December 2022 18:46:18 CET, rjmcmahon via Make-wifi-fast wrote: >Nice write up and work over the years=2E > >On tooling: > >iperf 2 supports full duplex, multiple parallel streams, tx start times, = bounceback, isochronous, etc=2E Man page is here > >https://iperf2=2Esourceforge=2Eio/iperf-manpage=2Ehtml > >The flows code in the flows directory > >https://sourceforge=2Enet/p/iperf2/code/ci/master/tree/flows/ > >is written in python 3 and leverages asyncio=2E > >https://docs=2Epython=2Eorg/3/library/asyncio=2Ehtml > >This is all released as open source=2E > >Bob >> This is where things stood on the wifi front, back in 2016=2E Nobody >> understood us=2E=2E=2E >>=20 >> https://docs=2Egoogle=2Ecom/document/d/1Se36svYE1Uzpppe1HWnEyat_sAGghB3= kE285LElJBW4/edit# >>=20 >> So I sort of enjoyed re-reading that this morning, and all the >> enthusiastic commentary we'd had on it=2E Perhaps we can reshape it and >> find ways to move forward today? >>=20 >> I am happy to have seen so many products hitting the market 5+ years >> later that leverage this work, many openwrt derived, like evenroute, >> quantum, and openwifi, others from pure linux, like eero and google >> fiber, and so far as I can tell, in many a chromebook, and of course >> ios and osx=2E >>=20 >> Still, there was so much work left to be done, and the work applied to >> all forms of wireless technology, be it 6 or 12ghz, or 60ghz, or >> starlink=2E Just the other day I was watching a 5G engineer that was >> struggling to get decent simultaneous throughput up and down, the test >> tool showing that, but not the 25 seconds of buffering built into the >> rmnet driver in poor conditions, and "only" 150ms perfect ones=2E This >> test tool shows "perfect" throughput for this device: >>=20 >> https://www=2Espinics=2Enet/lists/netdev/msg865852=2Ehtml >> (anyone know which tool it was? see image here: >> https://drive=2Egoogle=2Ecom/file/d/1gSbozrtd9h0X63i6vdkNpN68d-9sg8f9/v= iew >> ) >>=20 >> vs the actual, underlying, unusable 25 seconds!!! - result - if only >> that test tool attempted to start up even one more flow partially >> through the test, perhaps we'd be getting somewhere=2E An increasingly >> favorite test of mine is the staggered start "squarewave" tests in the >> flent suite=2E For those that haven't tried it, crusader is the first >> tool I've seen that not only has a staggered start latency under load >> test, but as its written in rust, runs on every OS in the planet=2E Giv= e >> it a shot? >>=20 >> https://github=2Ecom/Zoxc/crusader/releases/tag/v0=2E0=2E9-testing >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Rpm mailing list >> Rpm@lists=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet >> https://lists=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet/listinfo/rpm >_______________________________________________ >Make-wifi-fast mailing list >Make-wifi-fast@lists=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet >https://lists=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet/listinfo/make-wifi-fast --=20 Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail=2E Please excuse my brevity=2E ------DFQ0Z0J3RKNYLPB1XYNUJCB3ATYNC8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Bob,

What simple end users would need is= (semi-)public iperf2 servers accessible over the internet to be comparably= easy to use as iperf3=2E=2E=2E=2E

Regards
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Sebastian

On 6 Dece= mber 2022 18:46:18 CET, rjmcmahon via Make-wifi-fast <make-wifi-fast@lis= ts=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet> wrote:
Nice write up and work over the years=
=2E

On tooling:

iperf 2 supports full duplex, multiple parall=
el streams, tx start times, bounceback, isochronous, etc=2E Man page is her=
e

https://iperf2=2Esourceforge=2Eio/iperf-manpage=2Ehtml

The flow=
s code in the flows directory

https://sourceforge=2Enet/p/iperf2/code=
/ci/master/tree/flows/

is written in python 3 and leverages asyn=
cio=2E

https://docs=2Epython=2Eorg/3/library/asyncio=2Ehtml

This is=
 all released as open source=2E

Bob
This is where things stood on the wifi front, back in 2=
016=2E Nobody
understood us=2E=2E=2E

h=
ttps://docs=2Egoogle=2Ecom/document/d/1Se36svYE1Uzpppe1HWnEyat_sAGghB3kE285=
LElJBW4/edit#

So I sort of enjoyed re-reading that this morning,=
 and all the
enthusiastic commentary we'd had on it=2E Perhaps we can re=
shape it and
find ways to move forward today?

I am happy to have =
seen so many products hitting the market 5+ years
later that leverage th=
is work, many openwrt derived, like evenroute,
quantum, and openwifi, ot=
hers from pure linux, like eero and google
fiber, and so far as I can te=
ll, in many a chromebook, and of course
ios and osx=2E

Still, the=
re was so much work left to be done, and the work applied to
all forms o=
f wireless technology, be it 6 or 12ghz, or 60ghz, or
starlink=2E Just t=
he other day I was watching a 5G engineer that was
struggling to get dec=
ent simultaneous throughput up and down, the test
tool showing that, but=
 not the 25 seconds of buffering built into the
rmnet driver in poor con=
ditions, and "only" 150ms perfect ones=2E This
test tool shows "perfect"=
 throughput for this device:

https://www=2Espinics=2Enet/lists/netdev/msg=
865852=2Ehtml
(anyone know which tool it was? see image here:
https://drive=2Egoogle=2Ecom/file/d/1gSbozrtd9h0X63i6vdkNpN68d-9sg=
8f9/view
)

vs the actual, underlying, unusable 25 seconds!!! =
- result - if only
that test tool attempted to start up even one more fl=
ow partially
through the test, perhaps we'd be getting somewhere=2E An i=
ncreasingly
favorite test of mine is the staggered start "squarewave" te=
sts in the
flent suite=2E For those that haven't tried it, crusader is t=
he first
tool I've seen that not only has a staggered start latency unde=
r load
test, but as its written in rust, runs on every OS in the planet=
=2E Give
it a shot?

https://github=2Ecom/Zoxc/crusader/releas=
es/tag/v0=2E0=2E9-testing
Rpm mailing list
Rpm@lists=2Ebufferbloa=
t=2Enet
https=
://lists=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet/listinfo/rpm
Make-wifi=
-fast mailing list
Make-wifi-fast@lists=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet
https://list=
s=2Ebufferbloat=2Enet/listinfo/make-wifi-fast
<= div class=3D'k9mail-signature'>--
Sent from my Android device with K-9 = Mail=2E Please excuse my brevity=2E ------DFQ0Z0J3RKNYLPB1XYNUJCB3ATYNC8--