From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-wr1-x42d.google.com (mail-wr1-x42d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::42d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 16D4E3B2A4 for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2022 11:42:31 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail-wr1-x42d.google.com with SMTP id g12so20682150wrs.10 for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2022 08:42:31 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=l2MoIkH5i5crZQ0JU/hqnlfvw1zYoJYmTfMK5TDEXIA=; b=VQJJ6AKGidmm4IyoHq8i28Xf6wSjkxp4LTb9hl/9z1hIhy7F1bK8o9Ee64XHfuZUSQ QPoirnAXeg0ItgARt6Zq351eb2GlhIM2X7OFluaYg/1axaQu5nRyWUSv1nZN235TXUuJ azGibX5nb2ehRPaVy3X88rCS+eBGHQ4RigsFpeYs2hFqsOWE7yDFrRqkjP1RYP2xYa+Q efurmTTfkKCjRB9B9aaHNuy61Jz1Mqn5yG0hL/sjXLn4vM9bHt7bMlX4dtl+XR79oJpN /FHvuZ4lJjMA6ObZs5TX/gY9VGxGXqFyHzSZKcVNR9ydyIm33b/SnaXOOTJejJrY2Gm3 zKIw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=l2MoIkH5i5crZQ0JU/hqnlfvw1zYoJYmTfMK5TDEXIA=; b=Sc2I7I9uLMceSPV05VwkjL8PoejuJ5kIDhJQ7doWw/mdtyz8QbWOQXtXu7yN1X1VBQ 3D31nHM1XX2I2+OA7WZtJct6bt7TEh33XbgCA/MexyhNMimZ4IpZ1StjJbM6zoddML+H NMsv2YKwvOAm9ZBOBhKRGdNfz4TOG8Lqw9O1XKEo7ZSjrDJQkax/KkD8O7kufGQC6trj 43td9qLv26zjgl5kNGXkSKuoNfy2uuY2WT2NfHstRFdxhGpRyfk1w2xUJEq1s1TJ/BkE dkFCr0L2BRjo4BZQc1tUKLRjR/evzbHjjESheTolDJfevxU/3nxjow8pimj50r/jrpmW Qswg== X-Gm-Message-State: ANoB5pkleTZAScOi618cGozQGRDho7BhbXdXX7y7DEVzOqc4Ky9mld4J dshdeu0nkD7lPaiE7ESi5Rh47wZTNfRd1vJ6w42ZrKKYvrc= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AA0mqf6pBROVTcykGP8jUoBjByLaG6VJdfHBP7fzvQZ6ScyBfl2EATvTYlcLkMuyxaPdbLy1Pnv0T8jNhZpggK/xQTk= X-Received: by 2002:adf:fd10:0:b0:241:b42c:2e4e with SMTP id e16-20020adffd10000000b00241b42c2e4emr11870116wrr.482.1669048949766; Mon, 21 Nov 2022 08:42:29 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Dave Taht Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2022 08:42:14 -0800 Message-ID: To: "MORTON JR., AL" Cc: libreqos Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [LibreQoS] the k8 hairball X-BeenThere: libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Many ISPs need the kinds of quality shaping cake can do List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2022 16:42:31 -0000 On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 5:44 AM MORTON JR., AL wrote: > > I'll take that bet, Dave, because I'm sure it mentions Throughput (and I = only looked at part of the web page). It wouldn't be benchmarking without s= ome definition of Throughput... Nope. Not mentioned once. I shoulda hung an amount on that bet. Also, I was overly vague, I'd meant latency or latency under load... I have no idea why the k8 crowd thinks the network stack isn't something to worry about... > > Full Disclosure: I have seen an earlier K8s benchmarking study, it could = be related work. Among those of us who discussed the findings, one "knock" = was that they only tested with TCP streams. Benchmarking for RFC 2544 Throu= ghput requires UDP streams, no TCP flow-control complexities... > > Al > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: LibreQoS On Behalf Of Da= ve Taht > > via LibreQoS > > Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2022 9:28 PM > > To: libreqos > > Subject: [LibreQoS] the k8 hairball > > > > without reading this, I am willing to offer 3x1 odds this report does > > not mention one specific tcp related metric. > > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://humanitec.com/whitepapers/kubernete= s- > > benchmarking-study-2022__;!!BhdT!gy_08-Lw3wEiAgdspSMpcAGcLbfMq-my_- > > YYi47om7KKd1gPKSdrT6L3o95U3sYPPpciDoMZMouCUh54K8qkmxM$ > > > > Any takers? > > > > -- > > This song goes out to all the folk that thought Stadia would work: > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.linkedin.com/posts/dtaht_the-mu= shroom- > > song-activity-6981366665607352320-FXtz__;!!BhdT!gy_08-Lw3wEiAgdspSMpcAG= cLbfMq- > > my_-YYi47om7KKd1gPKSdrT6L3o95U3sYPPpciDoMZMouCUh54RS9Rq-c$ > > Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC > > _______________________________________________ > > LibreQoS mailing list > > LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libr= eqos__; > > !!BhdT!gy_08-Lw3wEiAgdspSMpcAGcLbfMq-my_- > > YYi47om7KKd1gPKSdrT6L3o95U3sYPPpciDoMZMouCUh54XdGMIEA$ --=20 This song goes out to all the folk that thought Stadia would work: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/dtaht_the-mushroom-song-activity-69813666656= 07352320-FXtz Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC