From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-wr1-x42c.google.com (mail-wr1-x42c.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::42c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by lists.bufferbloat.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 480443B29E for ; Mon, 24 Oct 2022 10:14:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-wr1-x42c.google.com with SMTP id h9so5391713wrt.0 for ; Mon, 24 Oct 2022 07:14:29 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:to:subject:message-id:date:from :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=gPRhkA19U0CqvaJLo9g14UiMNeqF+rCkdwmFj5kTnnE=; b=U6bmd48lEG9T3Xaa099DgS3SmQGlYE6PHb5chmV5fhh1adJ7+eQyDIOCK5FvIiM07Q ws7L/gMujvb7SWS9VqcexuIsw8che6fj6iLwCeKF/4qkBvRy8pKaTnnXi7CPlk4o9bDk xoetE7XSBUH5U+L9YsUswr803vRaVQCCct4/dB1exq/1nWDnEJQp4VfiH0wZLsnz/bBI tLeVKgPJirWie2+keVC+T5p7smFqaTDbMrgnpopUOjUGaNss7H9nv+hLGyXeSGDpxuLf 46Q1ZJnNmw4kSg7CXGtCFhPQOuvDKlpD4QZr1adevsZKCRPGggiU89WWw95ZZTKAN5xB 3kQw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:to:subject:message-id:date:from :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=gPRhkA19U0CqvaJLo9g14UiMNeqF+rCkdwmFj5kTnnE=; b=6w0Y56Ze5W21eUwcwnCB4+tllw8frJ3QrUGr5ibgWDY5frAnNwuVS3dNo+GgCNphVv Bz5vaWbIwS3G4wBWb2V3XUTPDSoIK+6qW8f/EhvU4jgCRTVLBXybsWPpFOwGd44l/L4a QoEkB4AqzjwxcQGLryuo8fWFnktsVhzb8HO/aNTcWTIBkJgRhyRo4ikloXXh1R3JB9Sc WNZwdaAqx2vBOBZ35kENDVHzXh0gKk+GFaqdh6AfPGgGfDDmSyA18CX9sppo/lhguFUP 6pVarXAn/v/0e5iuwjfqYNJtHw+dVS1+jaTf/h28Mr4kIxeoQRWS08TRJ0Q0r9MOdWU5 SqpQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ACrzQf1tfn2KmuXf2gSiSTXrIBFW9EtY6LZ9grsZEajJa4zK96Ytxx+s U/cu9DCThtRvPC4D+VqLwFF6eVMh2MU7RExzRPufDakbo5A= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMsMyM4pRws6TowQPDeBJfBsHH9TsWvWJfm4CCxb8V/7GCGm1O8dflYbCMtqlkiKbsqmxPnnJKj2GcS15bhOIWNETow= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:3cf:b0:231:6ed6:e978 with SMTP id b15-20020a05600003cf00b002316ed6e978mr21219641wrg.500.1666620867665; Mon, 24 Oct 2022 07:14:27 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Taht Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2022 07:14:15 -0700 Message-ID: To: libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: [LibreQoS] mice and elephants visualizations X-BeenThere: libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: Many ISPs need the kinds of quality shaping cake can do List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2022 14:14:29 -0000 All of us, including me! have a tendency to do things like measure a ton of flent or iperf sessions and consider the end result "good". Actual traffic looks nothing like that, with the vast majority of flows in slow start, and ending quickly. This old paper came to mind yesterday, in light of seeing bracket's qoe stuff land: http://www.cs.unc.edu/Research/dirt/proj/marron/MiceElephants/ One of fq_codel's and cakes hidden advantages is in the fq portion, where, for the first 3-5 round trips on a tcp connection, go out first, and that is in part why it runs circles around everything els= e. --=20 This song goes out to all the folk that thought Stadia would work: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/dtaht_the-mushroom-song-activity-69813666656= 07352320-FXtz Dave T=C3=A4ht CEO, TekLibre, LLC