[LibreQoS] Fwd: Broadband Accountability Brief

[LibreQoS] Fwd: Broadband Accountability Brief

[Dave Taht]

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---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Thomas Reid <Tom@reidconsultinggroup.com>
Date: Fri, Apr 28, 2023 at 11:03 AM
Subject: Broadband Accountability Brief
To: National Broadband Mapping Coalition <bbcoalition@marconisociety.org>


Hello All,



Thought at least some of you may appreciate the attached brief on achieving
accountability in broadband.



Take care,

Tom



*Tom Reid*

Reid Consulting Group LLC

740-590-0076

Tom@ReidConsultingGroup.com



-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"National Broadband Mapping Coalition" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
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<https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
.


-- 
AMA March 31: https://www.broadband.io/c/broadband-grant-events/dave-taht
Dave Täht CEO, TekLibre, LLC

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Re: [LibreQoS] Fwd: Broadband Accountability Brief

[Frantisek Borsik]

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And so, how to get from ISP claim to ISP proof? Upscaling anything like
this SamKnows' thing with US government from the past?
https://samknows.com/blog/mba-retrospective


All the best,

Frank

Frantisek (Frank) Borsik



https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik

Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714

iMessage, mobile: +420775230885

Skype: casioa5302ca

frantisek.borsik@gmail.com


On Sat, Apr 29, 2023 at 12:02 AM Dave Taht via LibreQoS <
libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:

>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
> From: Thomas Reid <Tom@reidconsultinggroup.com>
> Date: Fri, Apr 28, 2023 at 11:03 AM
> Subject: Broadband Accountability Brief
> To: National Broadband Mapping Coalition <bbcoalition@marconisociety.org>
>
>
> Hello All,
>
>
>
> Thought at least some of you may appreciate the attached brief on
> achieving accountability in broadband.
>
>
>
> Take care,
>
> Tom
>
>
>
> *Tom Reid*
>
> Reid Consulting Group LLC
>
> 740-590-0076
>
> Tom@ReidConsultingGroup.com
>
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "National Broadband Mapping Coalition" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to BBCoalition+unsubscribe@marconisociety.org.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com
> <https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
> .
>
>
> --
> AMA March 31: https://www.broadband.io/c/broadband-grant-events/dave-taht
> Dave Täht CEO, TekLibre, LLC
> _______________________________________________
> LibreQoS mailing list
> LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos
>

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Re: [LibreQoS] Fwd: Broadband Accountability Brief

[dan]

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I had a long response typed out here but I decided to simplify.  This brief
does what a lot do. 'trust us, our tests compensate for wifi'.  oh yeah?
how so?  much of the same bad information gathering and false conclusions
follow.


On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 3:16 AM Frantisek Borsik via LibreQoS <
libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:

> And so, how to get from ISP claim to ISP proof? Upscaling anything like
> this SamKnows' thing with US government from the past?
> https://samknows.com/blog/mba-retrospective
>
>
> All the best,
>
> Frank
>
> Frantisek (Frank) Borsik
>
>
>
> https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
>
> Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714
>
> iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
>
> Skype: casioa5302ca
>
> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com
>
>
> On Sat, Apr 29, 2023 at 12:02 AM Dave Taht via LibreQoS <
> libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
>> From: Thomas Reid <Tom@reidconsultinggroup.com>
>> Date: Fri, Apr 28, 2023 at 11:03 AM
>> Subject: Broadband Accountability Brief
>> To: National Broadband Mapping Coalition <bbcoalition@marconisociety.org>
>>
>>
>> Hello All,
>>
>>
>>
>> Thought at least some of you may appreciate the attached brief on
>> achieving accountability in broadband.
>>
>>
>>
>> Take care,
>>
>> Tom
>>
>>
>>
>> *Tom Reid*
>>
>> Reid Consulting Group LLC
>>
>> 740-590-0076
>>
>> Tom@ReidConsultingGroup.com
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "National Broadband Mapping Coalition" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email to BBCoalition+unsubscribe@marconisociety.org.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com
>> <https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>>
>> --
>> AMA March 31: https://www.broadband.io/c/broadband-grant-events/dave-taht
>> Dave Täht CEO, TekLibre, LLC
>> _______________________________________________
>> LibreQoS mailing list
>> LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos
>>
> _______________________________________________
> LibreQoS mailing list
> LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos
>

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Re: [LibreQoS] Fwd: Broadband Accountability Brief

[Frantisek Borsik]

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Indeed. I highly doubt that there's any hope in this regard.

Anyway, Dan, can You think of any possible incremental improvements that
You can come up with, as a layman?


All the best,

Frank

Frantisek (Frank) Borsik



https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik

Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714

iMessage, mobile: +420775230885

Skype: casioa5302ca

frantisek.borsik@gmail.com


On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 11:47 AM dan <dandenson@gmail.com> wrote:

> I had a long response typed out here but I decided to simplify.  This
> brief does what a lot do. 'trust us, our tests compensate for wifi'.  oh
> yeah?  how so?  much of the same bad information gathering and false
> conclusions follow.
>
>
> On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 3:16 AM Frantisek Borsik via LibreQoS <
> libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>
>> And so, how to get from ISP claim to ISP proof? Upscaling anything like
>> this SamKnows' thing with US government from the past?
>> https://samknows.com/blog/mba-retrospective
>>
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>> Frank
>>
>> Frantisek (Frank) Borsik
>>
>>
>>
>> https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
>>
>> Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714
>>
>> iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
>>
>> Skype: casioa5302ca
>>
>> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Apr 29, 2023 at 12:02 AM Dave Taht via LibreQoS <
>> libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
>>> From: Thomas Reid <Tom@reidconsultinggroup.com>
>>> Date: Fri, Apr 28, 2023 at 11:03 AM
>>> Subject: Broadband Accountability Brief
>>> To: National Broadband Mapping Coalition <bbcoalition@marconisociety.org
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> Hello All,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thought at least some of you may appreciate the attached brief on
>>> achieving accountability in broadband.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Take care,
>>>
>>> Tom
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *Tom Reid*
>>>
>>> Reid Consulting Group LLC
>>>
>>> 740-590-0076
>>>
>>> Tom@ReidConsultingGroup.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "National Broadband Mapping Coalition" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>> an email to BBCoalition+unsubscribe@marconisociety.org.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>> https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com
>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>> .
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> AMA March 31:
>>> https://www.broadband.io/c/broadband-grant-events/dave-taht
>>> Dave Täht CEO, TekLibre, LLC
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> LibreQoS mailing list
>>> LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> LibreQoS mailing list
>> LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net
>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos
>>
>

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Re: [LibreQoS] Fwd: Broadband Accountability Brief

[dan]

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For one, the testing data needs to include more increments.  This is
capitalism (in theory) so if you want a measure of consumer choice you
need.... choices.  showing a DSL or an aging wisp or other <=10Mbps service
and having a 200-300Mbps docsis offering overbuilt via gov' funds at twice
the price is really not choice.

I hate to say this because I'm typing this on my shiny macbook pro 16
m2.... but this is the apple model.  Simply don't make products in the
bottom or even medium end of the market and then you dont have to worry
about those products cannibalising the higher end products.  Why doesn't
spectrum/comcast/etc offer a 100x25 service?  because it would be 10-15
less than their 200-300 and some not unsubstantial percent of users would
choose that because of the price and be very happy with it.  And frankly,
they WOULD be very happy with it.

These programs that are about whomever can deliver gigabit first getting
the government supported monopoly are the opposite of every merit based
selection mechanism in capitalism.

There seems to be a presumption that if you can just get 'fiber' to the
home that the internet will be great, but that's just not reflected in the
ratings and reviews of providers across the gambut.  You'll see wisps
offering quite low speeds with very high ratings and fttx providers with
gig service getting really poor reviews.  If one of these low reviewed
companies is first to market with that gig (and they are... a lot...their
business model is to use government funds to build out...) then the
consumer didn't get a choice, there is no competition to give consumers a
choice.

This is basically a giant nanny-state model.  The government 'knows better'
than the consumer and will pick the technology and the company to deliver
it.

On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 3:51 AM Frantisek Borsik <frantisek.borsik@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Indeed. I highly doubt that there's any hope in this regard.
>
> Anyway, Dan, can You think of any possible incremental improvements that
> You can come up with, as a layman?
>
>
> All the best,
>
> Frank
>
> Frantisek (Frank) Borsik
>
>
>
> https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
>
> Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714
>
> iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
>
> Skype: casioa5302ca
>
> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com
>
>
> On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 11:47 AM dan <dandenson@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I had a long response typed out here but I decided to simplify.  This
>> brief does what a lot do. 'trust us, our tests compensate for wifi'.  oh
>> yeah?  how so?  much of the same bad information gathering and false
>> conclusions follow.
>>
>>
>> On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 3:16 AM Frantisek Borsik via LibreQoS <
>> libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>>
>>> And so, how to get from ISP claim to ISP proof? Upscaling anything like
>>> this SamKnows' thing with US government from the past?
>>> https://samknows.com/blog/mba-retrospective
>>>
>>>
>>> All the best,
>>>
>>> Frank
>>>
>>> Frantisek (Frank) Borsik
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
>>>
>>> Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714
>>>
>>> iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
>>>
>>> Skype: casioa5302ca
>>>
>>> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Apr 29, 2023 at 12:02 AM Dave Taht via LibreQoS <
>>> libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
>>>> From: Thomas Reid <Tom@reidconsultinggroup.com>
>>>> Date: Fri, Apr 28, 2023 at 11:03 AM
>>>> Subject: Broadband Accountability Brief
>>>> To: National Broadband Mapping Coalition <
>>>> bbcoalition@marconisociety.org>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hello All,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thought at least some of you may appreciate the attached brief on
>>>> achieving accountability in broadband.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Take care,
>>>>
>>>> Tom
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *Tom Reid*
>>>>
>>>> Reid Consulting Group LLC
>>>>
>>>> 740-590-0076
>>>>
>>>> Tom@ReidConsultingGroup.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>> Groups "National Broadband Mapping Coalition" group.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>>> an email to BBCoalition+unsubscribe@marconisociety.org.
>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com
>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> AMA March 31:
>>>> https://www.broadband.io/c/broadband-grant-events/dave-taht
>>>> Dave Täht CEO, TekLibre, LLC
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> LibreQoS mailing list
>>>> LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> LibreQoS mailing list
>>> LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos
>>>
>>

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Re: [LibreQoS] Fwd: Broadband Accountability Brief

[Frantisek Borsik]

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Yes. No way out of this, basically.

Anyway, I still love what Robert is doing:
https://jackrabbitwireless.com/performance/

He has upgraded Performance explanation on the website and it’s even more
on the point.

My hope is to see more and more small (W)ISPs competing with the big (and
in many instances, crony) ISPs with this approach. Thanks to LibreQoS.



On Mon, 1 May 2023 at 12:48 PM, dan <dandenson@gmail.com> wrote:

> For one, the testing data needs to include more increments.  This is
> capitalism (in theory) so if you want a measure of consumer choice you
> need.... choices.  showing a DSL or an aging wisp or other <=10Mbps service
> and having a 200-300Mbps docsis offering overbuilt via gov' funds at twice
> the price is really not choice.
>
> I hate to say this because I'm typing this on my shiny macbook pro 16
> m2.... but this is the apple model.  Simply don't make products in the
> bottom or even medium end of the market and then you dont have to worry
> about those products cannibalising the higher end products.  Why doesn't
> spectrum/comcast/etc offer a 100x25 service?  because it would be 10-15
> less than their 200-300 and some not unsubstantial percent of users would
> choose that because of the price and be very happy with it.  And frankly,
> they WOULD be very happy with it.
>
> These programs that are about whomever can deliver gigabit first getting
> the government supported monopoly are the opposite of every merit based
> selection mechanism in capitalism.
>
> There seems to be a presumption that if you can just get 'fiber' to the
> home that the internet will be great, but that's just not reflected in the
> ratings and reviews of providers across the gambut.  You'll see wisps
> offering quite low speeds with very high ratings and fttx providers with
> gig service getting really poor reviews.  If one of these low reviewed
> companies is first to market with that gig (and they are... a lot...their
> business model is to use government funds to build out...) then the
> consumer didn't get a choice, there is no competition to give consumers a
> choice.
>
> This is basically a giant nanny-state model.  The government 'knows
> better' than the consumer and will pick the technology and the company to
> deliver it.
>
> On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 3:51 AM Frantisek Borsik <
> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Indeed. I highly doubt that there's any hope in this regard.
>>
>> Anyway, Dan, can You think of any possible incremental improvements that
>> You can come up with, as a layman?
>>
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>> Frank
>>
>> Frantisek (Frank) Borsik
>>
>>
>>
>> https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
>>
>> Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714
>>
>> iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
>>
>> Skype: casioa5302ca
>>
>> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com
>>
>>
>> On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 11:47 AM dan <dandenson@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I had a long response typed out here but I decided to simplify.  This
>>> brief does what a lot do. 'trust us, our tests compensate for wifi'.  oh
>>> yeah?  how so?  much of the same bad information gathering and false
>>> conclusions follow.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 3:16 AM Frantisek Borsik via LibreQoS <
>>> libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> And so, how to get from ISP claim to ISP proof? Upscaling anything like
>>>> this SamKnows' thing with US government from the past?
>>>> https://samknows.com/blog/mba-retrospective
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> All the best,
>>>>
>>>> Frank
>>>>
>>>> Frantisek (Frank) Borsik
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
>>>>
>>>> Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714
>>>>
>>>> iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
>>>>
>>>> Skype: casioa5302ca
>>>>
>>>> frantisek.borsik@gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Apr 29, 2023 at 12:02 AM Dave Taht via LibreQoS <
>>>> libreqos@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
>>>>> From: Thomas Reid <Tom@reidconsultinggroup.com>
>>>>> Date: Fri, Apr 28, 2023 at 11:03 AM
>>>>> Subject: Broadband Accountability Brief
>>>>> To: National Broadband Mapping Coalition <
>>>>> bbcoalition@marconisociety.org>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hello All,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Thought at least some of you may appreciate the attached brief on
>>>>> achieving accountability in broadband.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Take care,
>>>>>
>>>>> Tom
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Tom Reid*
>>>>>
>>>>> Reid Consulting Group LLC
>>>>>
>>>>> 740-590-0076
>>>>>
>>>>> Tom@ReidConsultingGroup.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>>> Groups "National Broadband Mapping Coalition" group.
>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>>>> an email to BBCoalition+unsubscribe@marconisociety.org.
>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com
>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/marconisociety.org/d/msgid/BBCoalition/PH8PR11MB6879B0D32296F3BDA42A9425BA6B9%40PH8PR11MB6879.namprd11.prod.outlook.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>>>> .
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> AMA March 31:
>>>>> https://www.broadband.io/c/broadband-grant-events/dave-taht
>>>>> Dave Täht CEO, TekLibre, LLC
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> LibreQoS mailing list
>>>>> LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos
>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> LibreQoS mailing list
>>>> LibreQoS@lists.bufferbloat.net
>>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/libreqos
>>>>
>>> --
All the best,

Frank
Frantisek (Frank) Borsik

https://www.linkedin.com/in/frantisekborsik
Signal, Telegram, WhatsApp: +421919416714
iMessage, mobile: +420775230885
Skype: casioa5302ca
frantisek.borsik@gmail.com

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